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When your Kibbe type and personal style don't mix

psychedelicate

(website)

Hi all, this is my first topic, so bear with me.

A couple of days ago, I read Carole Jackson's Color Me Beautiful. I have resigned myself that I am a Spring, even though I love all black everything, because I've always kind of known it that the colors I love aren't necessarily the ones that are the most flattering.

But I then tried to figure out my style personality, and after going online and discovering Kibbe, it was far more difficult for me to resign myself to my results. While looking at Flamboyant Gamine on pinterest, polyvore, etc., everything in my heart goes YES. This is what I love and am drawn to. But the softness/daintiness of my figure points to Soft Gamine, which I can never imagine myself wearing. Personality-wise, Flamboyant is much more "me."

Has anyone else dealt with this, where what you love isn't what might be the most flattering? Are there workarounds--adding Soft Gamine shapes but with decidedly Flamboyant touches, for example? Or is it the whole point that I need to go Soft Gamine to really be who I truly am/unleash my full beauty, with this yearning for flamboyantness holding me back?

Body Type

38 replies

Latest reply was from Sheila

Caro in Oz

Veteran

Hi & welcome.

There are SO many theories about colour, style, fit etc. Some of them even contradict one another. So I think Angie is right when she says to use them as guidelines NOT rules. If I were you I would follow my heart

adorkable

Veteran

What she said.

If the color makes you smile, it will be flattering. A smile's the best accessory.

Kristin L

Veteran

Welcome. And ditto on what Caro said.

Niefern

I really do not understand these colour theories. I do not know what my best colours are, and nobody has ever told me "you look great in red/blue/whatever". So I simply buy what I like and that's it!

psychedelicate

(website)

I like to have guidelines It makes shopping easier. Whatever makes my face "come alive," I guess, like when a lipstick is so flattering it lights up your whole look.

rabbit

Veteran

I'm not familiar with Kibbe but I ditto the others. I mean I think anything your heart yearns for (as long as it's in your budget and fits your life) is something you should explore.

Your style aspirations might change with time, and you might modify or chose pieces that combine a bit of figure flattery with the style that calls to you - and various guidelines might help with learning something new, but true beauty is how you feel, not how you fit into an abstract system.

Also assuming you work with your skin and eye color, changing haircolor can tweak what seasonal category you fit into. At times my hair has been black, now it's dark brown. Sometimes it's been pure copper orange. At times I've also had a bit of a tan, freckles, and lighter sun bleached hair and it makes my eyes look greener. All those would shift my 'seasonal' color category a little, as much as losing or gaining weight or muscle tone would shift body categories a bit.

psychedelicate

(website)

Kibbe is about body type and archetypes, rather than color: http://seasonalcolor.yuku.com/.....yYh5_l_vAu

I am OK with my color palette, though, and find it helpful, rather than limiting. I also quite like my natural haircolor, and don't want to go back to any of the other colors I've tried!

deb

Veteran

We have had many discussion about kibbe and the other philosophies. Here are a few of the links.

http://youlookfab.com/welookfa.....ones-style

http://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/kibbe-types

http://youlookfab.com/welookfa.....david-zyla

Gaylene

Veteran

I think the operative word here is GUIDEline. Theories exist just to provide a particular perspective or possible explanation; if a particular theory doesn't fit your own philosophy or offer a useful perspective, why adopt it as a guideline?

Suz

(website)

Veteran

If you're convinced that you are some kind of gamine, why not simply play around with the different suggestions for both types until you find a balance that works for you? You may discover that you've "mis-typed" yourself (and what your heart yearns towards is closer to what suits you best) or, in the actual day -to -day wearing, you may learn that actually, soft gamine does work a whole lot better than you thought.

According to Kibbe's system, I'm a "dramatic classic" -- which actually makes a lot of sense to me. According to colour theory I'm a "cool" or "true" summer -- which also makes sense -- but which conflicts a little bit with "dramatic classic." The classic part is fine -- but summers are supposed to be soft and gentle, not dramatic. Or so they say. Except...er...I'm not such a soft and gentle person.

Meanwhile, according to Carol Tuttle's Dressing your Truth (or whatever it is called) -- I am a type 3, which in her view means I should also be an "autumn" in my colours. And my personality type should be forceful and dynamic. Except, well...I may not be soft, meek, and gentle, but I don't know if anyone has ever called me "forceful," either.

The upshot? Take what makes sense and have fun with fashion.

I find Kibbe extremely useful on silhouette and cut, and on the type of detailing that works best. But I don't get too hung up on it. Example: According to Kibbe, I should never wear a cropped jacket. It's not "sophisticated" enough for me. Well....there's a glimmer of truth in that. Yet I happily wear my cropped denim jackets with dresses and think they work just fine.

Caro in Oz

Veteran

I understand what you are saying about guidelines making shopping easier BUT as you said about Kibbe,
"....it was far more difficult for me to resign myself to my results".
My question is WHY would you want to resign yourself to the results? You are giving your knowledge & awareness of your likes & dislikes over to someone else - someone who doesn't know you. IMO it makes more sense to come to your own conclusions about what works for you & what makes your heart sing :).

psychedelicate

(website)

I think it is the What Ifs, when you read these kinds of things and the style consultants talk about how a person's life improved once they began dressing in the way that was "destined" for them, if that makes sense. Like how someone was wearing shapes all wrong for them, and then gained confidence once they saw how great they looked in the ones suited for them.

adorkable

Veteran

I guess I just feel like if you don't like what supposedly suits you, then it's not going to make your life better. I can see that being more true if you don't know what you like,

Janet

(website)

Veteran

I take all this stuff with a grain of salt. I am a very analytical person and enjoy figuring out what flatters me as much as the next person, but there is a limit. I've only read enough of the Kibbe stuff to be totally confused. I have a body shape and features that probably put me in some sort of romantic category -- I don't think there is a straight line on my body. But I also know that at this point in my life, I have figured out that I'm not a romantic dresser -- I like structure and even a bit of toughness in my looks. If some guidelines tell me I should be wearing ruffles and pink, it's doubtful I would suddenly feel more like myself dressing that way, even if it might be conventionally flattering to some degree.

If you feel like experimenting with a softer style, then try it out! But I wouldn't say you should do it because someone who does not even know you thinks it is best for you based on a checklist of physical characteristics.

psychedelicate

(website)

Suz, I actually just checked out Dress Your Truth and I'm squarely a Type 4, and several of the examples she gives for type 4s are also people commonly used as examples of Flamboyant Gamines. Perhaps the takeaway from this is that with my coloring and body type, I would fit into another type, but as others have mentioned, we have personalities and preferences, and this affects what we feel comfortable and ourselves in.

adorkable

Veteran

Yay! This sounds like a happy ending.

Gigi

Veteran

Welcome! This is a great post.

Reading your post prompted me to do the Kibbe analysis. I too am a Soft Gamine! :^) I haven't read up on what the style entails too much yet, but I do see some areas where that style doesn't agree with mine. For instance, the Soft Gamine is supposed to have a lot of curves and circular detailing in her clothing, but I like more angles. I think circular patterns make me look boring. But I may give it another chance, by combining the circular patterns with other more exciting elements, like bold colors. I am currently in the mood to experiment with my style (I'm not set in my style yet), so why not? :^)

I think what previous posters have said here is wise. These analyses are good for starting points, but at some point we realize that it's not emotionally the best thing to submit ourselves to these systems as rules that we MUST follow. The Kibbe and Color Me Beautiful are based on physical characteristics and not our personalities. I may have a very similar body structure to someone else but have a completely different personality; therefore, I will be drawn to different colors and styles than that other person.

I began coming to the forum about 9 months ago, and at that time I really delved into buying clothes that suited my Deep Autumn self (fyi, there are more-detailed seasonal systems that divide each season up into three subseasons, if you're not confident that Spring is 100% accurate for you). I was very happy doing that at first, but after a while I started to get bored. I wanted pink...pretty, feminine pink...which looks atrocious on me. And mint green! I could hardly have picked two colors that would be more unflattering. Yet there is something in my emotional makeup that is yearning for those colors. So I am following my heart--bought some mint green nail polish the other day. :^) I would say to follow whatever elements of Soft Gamine that you like or want to experiment with, and leave it at that. You can always come back and play with other elements of the style later, if you decide you want to give them another chance. But I sure wouldn't feel obligated to follow someone's rules about how to dress.

psychedelicate

(website)

Gigi, YES! Using soft gamine shapes with more flamboyant choices is exactly what I'm planning on doing. This picture http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg......7569ff.jpg
compares the two styles, and what I'd do is wear the Flamboyant outfit (which I LOVE and is absolutely something I'd wear), but switch out the skirt for the Soft Gamine skirt, or maybe one with a peplum, which would be more flattering for me than something with the gathering the flamboyant skirt has in the front.

In terms of colors, I am a Light Spring in the more detailed analysis. I do actually like the light spring colors; I'm just really in love with wearing black! So what I am planning on doing is keeping my black motorcycle jacket, for example, but I will pair it with a scarf in a color from my palette to get some flattering color near my complexion.

I looked at the Deep Autumn palette, and there's a lovely jade green and some salmon pink. Have you tried those? They may cure your mint/pastel pink hankerings. But of course, you love what you love!

Suz

(website)

Veteran

psychedelicate -- I believe that if Angie had her colours "done" she would emerge as a spring of some kind. And she wears black often. She just makes sure to pair it with one of her light or bright colours or neutrals -- blush, white, pale blue. And with some skin. She doesn't go for "all black" outfits as a rule, but has found a way to keep black in her wardrobe.

She also has a great blog post on ways to wear your less flattering colours.

Gigi

Veteran

Thanks for the link to the two Gamines! Now that I see them side by side, I too am much more drawn to the Flamboyant version. Hmmm. What's funny though is that Flamboyant Gamine didn't even come up as an option for me. My choices were Soft Gamine or Theatrical Romantic.

I feel like the Soft Gamine is a little too cheruby or something. I in fact had a post just the other day about always feeling like I look like a child and wanting to experiment with ways of dressing that would make me look "grown up." And it's not just looking young for your age...my facial features and my bone structure will always make me look "cute" and "sweet." I suppose that is the essence of the Soft Gamine. But I think it's too saccharine. I imagine you are feeling the same way?

Thanks for the Deep Autumn color recs. I'm glad you were able to look at the 12-season system too...it's so helpful. I have been on the lookout for salmon pink; I haven't tried jade green yet. However, I know that my "inner child" wants the pretty feminine icy pink and the mint green. So that's what she gets! :^) I think part of the influence is spring coming. I always subconsciously am drawn to pastels in spring, even though they look terrible on me. This is the first year I am allowing myself to wear them even though they look awful.

psychedelicate

(website)

Suz, thanks for the link! I also try to practice keeping black away from my face, but I can only imagine myself having a black coat, especially where I live, which is full of slush and general dirtiness, and anything except black would turn brownish-gray in a week!

Gigi, if you look at Carol Tuttle's Dressing Your Truth videos on youtube, she has a point about when you deny your true nature, it just emphasizes what you don't like. So if you hate looking youthful and cute and try to wear really mature-looking clothes, it will just make you look MORE childlike. I haven't really tried it, but in the videos where she put different kinds of women in different kinds of outfits it was pretty convincing.

I am not really opposed to looking cute and sweet (although my facial features are probably too strong for a "true" gamine; I have a strong nose like you'd find in a Soft Dramatic); what I don't like about Soft Gamine is that it is so girly and feminine. It's not that I'm against looking feminine and I want to look less girly; it's just that it's not who I am. My mom always tried to make me more girly and put me in floral things and pastels, and I was always a tomboy who wanted to wear black. I'm not really a tomboy anymore, but I'm also not going to be in a floral dress with soft curls anytime soon!

Perhaps in between "soft gamine" and "flamboyant gamine" is plain old gamine... but it's too cheeky and tomboyish for me, I think.

Mo

(website)

Veteran

Wow, way too much thinking for me . . . and I'm an analytical type at heart. I feel it's best to just wear what you feel is authentically you. These authors are speaking in abstracts and pooling the billions of people on this earth into just a couple of categories. Surely we are more unique than that??

rabbit

Veteran

I kind of agree with Mo. At a certain point, the emphasis on following a system is just marketing trying to convince you you are doing something wrong and need to buy something. Looking at two of the 'Dressing Your Truth' videos, I'm not sure I'd want to take style advice from the narrator... the way she styles the various outfits and herself just doesn't appeal to me personally.

Also I'm a bit suspicious of anything that pushes 'nature' over 'nurture'/choice/free will. Yes, pay attention to cuts and colors and find ways to combine what you love with what is an easily flattering silhouette or color on you if you want to. However, I look at actresses and how they can completely subsume themselves into a role and look interesting/attractive but in completely different styles, colors and cuts. (Of course they have got great makeup, hair, and wardrobe people at their disposal -- but those people match the look to the role, not the other way around.)

psychedelicate

(website)

Right, but if you go back to actresses, you wouldn't cast Sophia Loren in a Doris Day role. Maybe that's why so many beautiful actresses get their Oscars when they go for a role where they un-glam themselves and are someone so completely different.

Caro in Oz

Veteran

Interesting that you bring up acting I worked in casting for TV & the thing I discovered was if the actor was good enough they could take on & succeed in just about any role (obviously a 60 yo is not going to be able to play a 12 yo, but within reason). In my opinion (& it is only my opinion) the ones who got "type cast" were either stuck somewhere in their emotional lives OR were dealing with directors or other casting people who couldn't see past their last couple of roles. I like rabbit's point about nature/nurture too - it can start to look a bit like biology is destiny imo.

rae

(website)

Veteran

I always feel like I should have someone else do my Kibbe for me. Sometimes I feel like I have slight body dysmorphia because even with the example photos, I have no idea what my cheekbones are like, or if my fingers are small. No clue! So I end up choosing C on everything like I'm guessing on a scantron test...

Gigi

Veteran

Caro, you are always so wise! I think you hit the nail on the head with what the problem is with many of these systems--your biology determines your stylistic fate.

Psychdelicate, good point about how dressing the opposite of your type actually makes you look more like your type! If I wore some very manly outfits or very hard-edged "biker" outfits, that's exactly what would happen. I don't mind looking somewhat youthful and childlike (I just bought a couple of skater skirts), but it seems like Soft Gamine goes off the deep end. I'm just trying to skew things in the other direction a bit, as it sounds like you are doing.

I do agree that physical attributes can make a particular actress perhaps very suitable for a role on the surface, but as Caro points out, more probing and auditions may reveal that a different actress has interior capabilities that make her even better for the part. So there is always the difference between one's physical appearance and one's interior make-up.

I do think that the Kibbe guidelines are worth experimenting with, simply because they are so precise. I've been wanting to experiment with my style, and there are quite a few things on the Soft Gamine list that are worth checking out. That is, they already appeal to me. But peter pan collars? Not in a million years!

Gaylene

Veteran

Categorization is a useful tool for helping to compartmentalize human
behavior when building a theory, but it's not without its problems.
People are complicated entities and reducing their preferences,
behaviors, appearance, or whatever into four, eight, sixteen, or even fifty
thousand categories, is a very error-prone business. People can usually be slotted into more than one category and the final decision often comes down to one or two characteristics out of the hundreds available. That's why legitimate theories which group people into categories also recognize that very few people would ever completely display the full set of characteristics--and only those characteristics--for a particular category. To complicate the issue even further, the category descriptions and premises that are developed almost always refer to the extreme ends of a continuum--the "true" type, so to speak--which actually describes only a small subset of all those who reside in the category.

Given all these complications, I guess what I'm trying to say that it is entirely possible you could fall between the category of Kibbe's "soft gamine" and "flamboyant gamine"...along with displaying a few characteristics of his other categories as well. That's why I get puzzled at the notion that dressing according to the restrictions of a selected category could somehow be more reflective of a person's "real" self than if a person just chose what instinctively he or she liked. If you aren't drawn towards girly and feminine, how could this be your "true nature"? We are more than just our bone structure or skin tones, and our clothing choices ought to reflect the whole of who we are as unique individuals--with minds and personalities as well as bodies.

ETA: And, by the way, Sophia Loren did do a Doris Day-type comedy in the 50s in a film called Houseboat with Cary Grant.

psychedelicate

(website)

According to Wikipedia, Houseboat may not be the best example, since Loren was a replacement for Betsy Drake, who wrote the movie for herself and Grant to star in, once it was discovered that Loren and Grant were having an affair. I had actually never heard of that movie before and Doris Day and Sophia Loren were just the two actresses who popped into my mind first, because they're often used as examples as two distinct types of women.

I do think it's true that most people are a mix of categories, and there are definitely serious limitations. It has also been bothering me, when I think about it, how physically limiting the categories seem to be. Like, obviously not all petite women have gamine faces, even though that's the only category he really gives to petite women, and some tall women are going to have a face with smaller features not found in a Dramatic or Natural face.

But mostly I think this kind of thing can be fun to think about, and helpful at times. And of course, everyone who creates this kind of system is going to make it seem like theirs can change your life--they do have a product to sell.

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