For those long-time fabbers who remember me, thanks for the shout out :)! I don't want to belabor my point, but wanted to clarify my thinking, esp in response to a few comments: In any sort of group, the dominant mode of thinking/behaving at the individual level becomes the social norm.

So if you have a group of 100 people who form a community (whether online or in-person), and 95 of them think/behave in a similar way that clusters together on one side of the thinking/behaving continuum (i.e., there can be diversity or heterogeneity within the group, naturally, but there is a clustering of the similarly-minded), then that majority will create a social norm. And then the other 5 people who aren't clustering around that norm will automatically, by definition, be outliers.

There doesn't need to be any explicit bias or openly stated negative, critical judgment at the individual level for norms to be created and then enforced--social norms just arise automatically within social groups, and then over time norms are upheld. So a bunch of people all thinking similarly and holding similar beliefs and behaving (e.g., dressing) in similar ways (note I'm not saying the same, but similar) will automatically create a norm. There is nothing inherently good or bad about norms, they just are.

And to be part of the majority/norm feels comfortable, such that you might not even notice there is a norm :). There is a sense of belonging and of feeling understood, which feels really good. And to be an outlier can feel less comfortable, or even uncomfortable, and there may be less of a sense of belonging. Because you are distinctly different from the norm, by definition.

So, to connect all of this directly to YLF (can you tell I'm a social scientist who enjoys rambling on about these sorts of social processes? lol): Yes, of course, there is diversity in terms of what people wear, because it would be impossible for everyone to dress identically, like identical twins or something (though I'm sure there is an online forum for that!). But, if the vast majority of individual people who post on the YLF forum favor dressing in ways that aren't oversized, or favor more classic silhouettes--and emphasize that this is their personal, individual preference, of course--then all of these individual preferences will together be the norm. So someone like Irina (or me, if I posted my WIWs), who wears oversized clothes, will be the outlier. And being an outlier just isn't as comfortable, as I noted above.

Think the concept of fashion rules is outdated cause we now have so much more variety available. You have to experiment a lot to find out what are pleasing styles/colors/and even proportions for your own eyes/ body/and life- so lacking that full interest/time/funds/enough variety in your closet etc. for doing that hard work for yourself you are pushed to start with using the main rules created from others...for themselves!:-) And that can be a good starting point but should never refrain you from experimenting.
For ex. believe the rules about not using a color with another is dated exactly because they come from an era where only a very few (and generaly only very basic/neutral or even harsh) colors were available on the market.
Aditionallly, I never completely understood the concept of personal color analysis- at least not for getting a verdict for lifetime- as your complexion can be so dependent on so many factors (actual season, natural vs. artificial lights/ age, etc) and perception of color can be dependent on textures, too.
I also am firmly convinced any color can work/look good on everybody (if wanted) just put it on a good background or in good frames (using adiacent or contrasting shades with intention can help) so you can always take inspiration from art (see Vivienne files, for ex).

To respond Jonesy, above. I unfortunatey don't remember your wiw from the past but I always love to see Irina's from when she started posting the forum (and I now understand you have somehow similar styles, yeay!) so I'd love to see your's, too- if so incline to post again. Will genuinelly thank you for that!

I am astounded to learn of you both possibly ever feeling outliers here for wearing the oversize trend...(???& sobbing). Yes, I also feel that oversized is not the norm on this forum but unfortunatley it is also not the norm in my neck of the woods, either. We are so left behind here! It can be I am not into wearing oversized at the moment but I am always open to learn and try something new I see on others and like for myself. I love to be on YLF exactly for that, to get inspiration on new (for me) things/styles worn IRL by RL people and different (hopefully confident) bodies so I can train my eyes and extend the spectrum of that mainstream social norm and then I may become brave enough to try myself, too.

This thread is meaty in the best possible way (lots to chew on)! Jonesy I did so love your social scientist's perspective (anthropology/philosophy major way back when). There is, of course, a certain level of self-selected conformity on this or any such forum but I have stood firm with certain unpopular at the time opinions (e.g. second hand first, going grey a bit before it was a thing, wearing unconventional pieces) and felt almost completely supported or at least not uncomfortable. Maybe that is just me.
Irina I believe you are the one that inspired me to get mesh ballet flats and that was a great purchase. I love your WIWs and am sad you feel they are not appreciated.
FWIW, I actually feel there is a healthy amount of diverse perspectives and styles within the limits of the small sample that have chosen to take part on this forum.

Jonesy, thanks for your explanation (and gentle tone). But I would like to (respectfully) disagree with your conclusion.

I think wearing oversized clothing is only one aspect of style, and one way of being outside the norm here.

I post summer outfits in northern winter and vice versa. That’s outside the norm in this very northern hemisphere forum. I’d like a dollar for every time a forum member posts “what styles are you feeling for Spring?” When I’m entering Autumn. Or “how’s everyone feeling about Winter?” When I’m in Summer. Way to feel like an outlier. (I know that no offence is intended.)

I wear maxi skirts. A lot. Outside the norm. I’m not sure I have ever seen anyone else post a maxi skirt or dress here.

I wear low contrast outfits. Outside the norm. Unpopular opinion: most people here prefer high contrast.

I wear lots of jewellery - beads, cuffs, amulets. Outside the norm. Unpopular opinion: most people here prefer a minimalist look when it comes to accessories.

I don’t wear cropped pants. At all. Outside the norm. Unpopular opinion: cropped pants are the most popular item of choice here.

Angie wears bright colours. Outside the norm. Unpopular opinion: most people here prefer neutrals.

Angie does not wear black. Outside the norm. Unpopular opinion: most people here love black.

Angie wears white jeans in winter. Outside the norm. Most people here reserve them for summer. I don’t wear them at all so I’m outside the norm too.

I could go on. My point is, everybody (including Angie) is an outlier here in some respect. Maybe it’s our outlierdom (new word!) that makes our style unique and interesting.

Of course it’s possible to feel left out when the forum seems enthusiastic about a style that you are not enthusiastic about (or vice versa). But it’s swings and roundabouts. Sometimes you will be in the majority camp, sometimes you won’t. I think that’s why Angie often posts her “are you team x” posts. They are a useful reminder that there is always a diversity of opinions on Every. Single. Style Matter. I think embracing and even celebrating that is a great part of participating here.

Thanks for clarifying Jonesy -- and I see another issue. If you are the only person (or almost the only person) posting photos that illustrate a preference that is quite outside the norm, the feedback you receive may not be as valuable -- assuming you're looking for feedback, that is. Your "audience" may not be educated enough to appreciate what you are doing. And that can feel alienating. Or simply make you feel like there's no point to it.

This happens in artistic and creative communities of all kinds. There is or can be a value in belonging to a group in which one is an outlier (you learn what others quite different from you think and feel and learn how they "read" you and your approach) but there's also a risk, because you are making yourself more vulnerable for what might amount to very little payoff.

As women or female identifying forum members, we've probably all felt a version of the discomfort you speak of when we are the minority in a majority group of men...and POC feel it in majority white environments...I get it. It's not like someone is deliberately putting anyone else down (though sometimes-- all too often -- they are!)...but the effects can be disempowering or worse, regardless of intentions or even stated values.

On the other hand..... in regard to the forum, specifically, I still maintain that there are many variables and at some point or other, almost any one of us might legitimately feel like an outlier on some dimension or another. As you pointed out, oversized looks are not the norm here -- though in fact, since styles have become more oversized in the past few years, probably most of us, even the modern classic dressers, do own at least a few oversized items. I know I do! And I wear them with delight -- now that they are more available at retail in a size/ shape that works for me, I'm all on board.

But oversized looks are not the only "outside the norm" looks you will see here. For instance, more of us probably wear neutrals more often than bright colours -- so those who frequently wear brights (even Angie on her own forum!) are arguably outliers. Very few of us dye our own clothing or as carefully conceive and plan a seasonal palette and silhouette as Brooklyn does. This makes her an outlier on that dimension. (And a lot of us are inspired by this all the time!) Some, but not many, are sewists or knitters and make many of their own clothes -- outliers. Some thrift exclusively -- outliers. Some buy designer clothing -- outliers. Some love to pattern mix and others hate pattern and avoid it entirely -- both could be considered outliers, depending on the day or month and who happens to be posting. Some are ultra-maximalist. Some are minimalist. The majority are probably in between so those on the poles are outliers.

Obviously, you can take this too far -- not every difference makes a person an outlier -- some are insignificant (including some I've mentioned here, maybe).

In the end, I love to encounter different styles here (and in the real world, where sadly, I almost never do...). So if it is uncomfortable for those on the poles to post, then perhaps as a group we can address the problem somehow. I would be eagert o have that conversation. It seems to me that the more variety we encounter, the more we are open to and the better we become at appreciating difference.

Brooklyn, we cross posted and it is so funny because I was going to mention the seasonal outliers too!!

I absolutely LOVE all of these responses and am reminded of how delightful the dialogue here can be!

Jaime, you are definitely unique and distinctive in your amazing thrifting and styling skills! Your wardrobe is truly astonishing and I love how you can rotate pieces--many of them quite unconventional and "pushed"--in and out to suit your fancy, all the while maintaining such a clear style vision. You are inspiring to me.

Brooklyn, OMG, yes, you are certainly an outlier in many ways, as you have beautifully illustrated with all of your examples! And your creativity, style, and presence enrich the forum so much. You have inspired me to dye several things rose brown, a color I would have never considered before seeing your magical way with beautiful dyes.

Suz, you are so wise, thoughtful, and kind! I love your analysis and appreciate your insight and generosity. You have amazing style! You have inspired me to embrace the navy in all of its dimensions :), and to find ways to integrate the more functional pieces with the more fashion-y ones in my wardrobe.

I guess some of it might come down to my personal level of comfort. As I was writing my post yesterday, I realized that at the same time I was pulling back from the forum, I was feeling out of step with the majority of my work colleagues, so it felt like a double-whammy, or perhaps I was just more sensitive to that feeling at that particular time.

Anyway, thanks for talking with me, and thanks, Irina, for starting this interesting conversation.

Oh...Jonesy, that makes total sense. There are times when it can feel like a fun challenge to be an outlier...and times when it just feels awful.

Funny fact -- I actually belonged to a small writing group that we called "Outliers" for.a while. (We were outliers because we were experimenting with form in a genre where that as not the norm.)

I think it's fair for people to come and go as works in their own lives. And for people to post photos or not, or comment or just read.

Thank you for your kind words. I feel like a style baby, still, but have grown so much more comfortable with my closet since coming here and getting help from Angie and all of you.

Well, although I greatly appreciate such deep thoughts on the issue of diversity, it wasn’t exactly my point
I tried, probably unsuccessfully, to bring to everyone’s attention that negative stereotypes are used about some styles. I think Jonesy specifically mentioned it.

“Sloppy, shapeless”, I vaguely remember even “menopausal dressing” was said. Maybe I’m wrong but I don’t think negative adjectives were used when speaking about maxi skirts or classic pants.

Irina--also a lover of black. My latest post, of stuff I bought on Poshmark, is all black and grey stuff. By accident. Not planned. Just love black and grey. Never got an analysis, but I have been told black is a good color for me, as it is for a couple ginger relatives. I will always marvel at how black can look good on redheads with pale eyebrows. I would like to get an analysis, but I will remember what you said about going with your own instinct.

The shape of clothing...I mean, I suppose there is a lot to say. You are right in that there does not need to be one way anymore, nor one idea of what is flattering. I do think the concept is good for people who are new or poor at fashion. To learn, for instance, a safe neckline. A versatile dress. Etc. I believe in "sexy clothes" but also wouldn't wear them all the time.

But I will stir the pot...on the idea of "pop of color," etc. being unnecessary because beautiful clothes can speak for themselves. They sure can, but these architectural, beautiful clothes (Eileen Fisher, COS, Issey Miyake) are out of the affordability of most women. Many women on this group can buy higher-end stuff. Some, like me, do closeout sales and thrift stores.

Adding a red lip, a red purse, a hat, some bangle bracelets, loud shoes, whatever--these are going to jazz up a very average shirt or dress. They are definitely not necessary for a well-cut outfit...but they are such good advice for high street/Target-type brands.

Carol, I see your point on pop of color. BTW, My Eileen Fisher pieces were bought either on sale or second hand. Poshmark is a great source for affordable EF clothing, at least in Canada. I probably buy 1 full price COS item a year. Admittedly, I spend more on shoes

Irina--well, a good reminder to me that it is out there on Poshmark! I tend to forget they carry nearly every brand.

You know what is ironic to me ? I don’t consider your clothing to be oversize , Irina . The pieces look like very contemporary fashion -oriented clothing - and “ normal “ to my eye . Oversized to me is exaggerated street wear style - or some of the ultra high end designer stuff ( The Row comes to mind ) . Funny how it’s all in the eye of the beholder .

Hhmm, when I commented early in this thread I did not realise it was about unpopular opinions on YLF specifically but rather out there in the world in general. I have personally never had a negative comment regarding my long hair here or anywhere else for that matter. It's just a general old fashioned 'rule'. IRINA and JONESY you guys get so much approval for your outfits and style on YLF (I did a back look at old posts) so I'm sad you feel anything to the contrary. I feel comfortable here even though no-one dresses RATE like me. GOLDEN PIG has popped up again and she seems to enjoy RATE dressing too. The thing is I like being an outlier, always have, so I don't notice the 'noise'. What I find difficult is when comments are misconstrued and then others follow that same misconstrued tack. That is probably normal on social media I guess.

I mentioned on another thread all the EF things I have - dresses, coats, etc. Nearly everything was bought on sale or used. As much as I love it, it’s too pricey for me otherwise. If I see something I like, I stalk it. Sometimes I win, sometimes I lose.

Jonesy (welcome back!) and Irina, I would love to see more of your oversized looks for inspiration! (I can't see Irina's WIW's because the pics are hidden). I think it's great to have all sorts of styles represented and I would hope that people don't feel like they have to conform to some standard or groupthink. In addition to different styles, I also like seeing outfits on all types of bodies, I don't have a "model body" and I think most of us don't (and shouldn't have to!) Diversity of viewpoints/styles/wearers is what makes fashion interesting!

Goldenpig, I’ve opened my last year’s WIW. I think that regulars here see photos once I post them and there is no reason to keep it open. But maybe I’m wrong.

Oh thank you Irina! I love your style! The wide/oversized styles look fresh and avant garde to me. I think it could be a good solution for my apple waist. Like I posted a dress belted because that's what I thought you were supposed to do, create a waist, and everybody liked it unbelted better. And I think people tend to think things look better in the larger size when I post K/R's in M & L. It certainly feels more comfy to have things looser. I'll have to see if I can recreate some of these oversized looks with wide legs jeans and culottes.
Thanks for opening up your photos again. Since I just picked back up it's nice to see people's WIWs even if they're old. I enjoyed looking back at my old WIW's and it's fun that they're still on the blog. If it becomes a privacy issues I may hide them but it's nice to be able to still see them and everyone's styles.

I agree with Star about finding it difficult if comments people have made are misconstrued and that goes on for a while. If someone doesn’t like a style and says so, usually in general, it’s not a personal attack against the person who does like that style! It’s different tastes. Like a recent thread on dropped shoulders. The poster didn’t like them, several people agreed, others liked them or didn’t notice any issues with them.

Now that you said it LJP , I have to confess neither do I consider Irina's clothing to be all that really oversized-at least not compared to what I see online. I also see rather that true contemporary oriented lines and fits in her clothing you also said - but it is definitely more loose and oversized compared to what I see being the norm in my neck of the woods. I see this type of fits mainly on youngsters only -so it is always great to have inspiration for the actual age group I belong to.

Brooklyn I always appreciated your midi/maxi skirted outfits posted as I am also a skirt girl at my heart which also loves a midi/maxi length for me. It was told I did have great legs (in the past:-))for a knee length pencil but in fact I was kind of suffering in the decades of the shorter lengths as find the midis give me better proportions.

I am a rare poster nowadays for various reasons and I am so sorry it seems in the past I posted more of my work/office outfits only (as I was eager to break the boredom and the rut meanwhile aimed to stay proffesional enough for an office). But somewhere in the last decade I slowly switched from knee lengths to midis even for work (and I mean longer midcalf tubes here- not only below the knee). Surely workwear casualisation helped a lot, too! I can confess I even stocked up on midi/maxi skirts and dresses (pleated, A-lines, satin, mesh you get it) for the fear of returning the era of the shorter hems which I doubt will do again at my age(and body) other than for some true hot and casual summer wear.