Normal is the new black? - YouLookFab Forum

Category

General

Welcome! Read about what to wear and how to wear it on the YLF Blog. Join the YLF Forum to ask specific questions or just chat about fashion and personal style. Or check out the curated list of things we love in YLF Finds.

Outfits Ensembles Trends Advice

Normal is the new black?

Helena

Veteran

Hi there,

I saw an article online this morning about 'normcore', which I had never heard of until today (I then scanned a number of other articles to get more of the idea of it). Basically in this article, it talks about the shift from trying to 'stand out' to trying to be more 'part of the group', I guess in reaction to how individualistic society is (caveat: this post should in no way be construed as critical to those who use fashion as a form of self-expression of individuality - express on if it's you!).

The article notes that in some circles it's become code for dressing 90's retro, since there is nothing normal (these days) about wearing bright white sneaks and mom jeans as a fashion statement. But the core of the idea - just embracing normal-ness - intrigues me.

It makes me think about my own style, which tends toward the very understated, as well as many comments and themes on this forum lately that speak to the same feeling - e.g. Angie's audience post, and comments around dressing to fit in with the season, with the environment, dressing with appropriateness in mind, etc. I admit I enjoy the affirmation that maybe trying to blend in might be an expression of confidence for a certain type of person, rather than the reverse.

I find it very thought-provoking and wonder what anyone thinks about this 'trend' (anti-trend?) Love to hear your thoughts and comments!

General

56 replies

Latest reply was from Aziraphale

ironkurtin

Veteran

I think normcore is ironic as opposed to earnest. It's about trying to blend in as a rebellious, snarky response to trying too hard. I agree there are positive elements to the idea of relaxing with your wardrobe but normcore to me isn't it.

It's like the current rage for Tevas. Ugly comfortable shoes as rebellion against beautiful uncomfortable shoes. The people who started this did it self-consciously, plus I find Tevas with socks heinous, plus you can get comfortable pretty shoes... Trying to be ostentatiously normal and comfortable strikes me as just the same work as the other way round.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

We've had a few lively discussions on this in the last few weeks. Angie even mentioned it in the blog -- one of the markers of 2014 style is "hip to be square."

Some links: http://youlookfab.com/welookfa.....e-what-the

and: http://youlookfab.com/welookfa.....not-ironic

Helena

Veteran

ironkurtin - from what I read, I totally agree, it's been pre-empted by hipsters to be ironic ... however, do you think it might have something earnest at its core, e.g. in the example of Steve Jobs? I sort of liked the comment about smaller towns often being genuinely "normcore" (not sure if it was in the this article or another I saw) - I just spent a week in a smaller town in Florida, where brands are non-existent and people seem to just dress for their life rather than for show ... I would say it was "genuine normcore' and it was very relaxing!

Suz, thanks for the links ... told you I am slow on trends

Angie

(website)

Fashion Stylist

Thanks for linking for me, Suz. You are so fab.

Torontogirl, normcore is supposed to be a cool anti-fashion movement. The current Birkenstocks trend is a small sub section of this movement. But it's all on a continuum because there are degrees of normcore.

Part of me thinks like IK. The other part enjoys the democracy of fashion. I am torn.

Helena

Veteran

Thanks Angie - I get it now. And here I thought it was a genuine movement towards more authenticity with a sidewing that was taking it all too seriously *sigh* ... oh well, this forum proves that authenticity can be dressed up, dressed down, expressive, understated, trendy, plain and everything in between! Thanks goodness!

VernieJane

Interesting...I think this is an inevitable stage of fashion at some point, seeing as everything comes back around as fashionable every few décades... Whatever is new and shocking becomes the new trend, then it becomes mainstream, then it becomes has-been, and then it will come back in 15 years or so. In the meantime, once everything has been done, there leaves "nothing shocking" if you will, and therefore "normal" can become the new fashion statement.. Yes, intriguing, yet not surprising when you think about it. Thanks for the thought-provoking thread!

Helena

Veteran

Thanks VernieJane ... I guess when I read about it, I wondered (hoped?) that, before the hipsters got hold of it and started making it about ironically-worn tevas with socks or whatever the heck they are wearing, that it was the inkling of a shift from "look at me!" to "we are in it together", thus less of a need to stand out vs. fit in. Daydreaming, I guess ...

MsMary

Veteran

Honestly, aren't most of the people out there in Real Life doing just that? Dressing to fit in with whatever crowd with which they run, and not really worrying about their clothes much beyond that? I really think those of us who think a lot about our clothes and fashion and style are a minority.

Anonymous

Well I for one, want to carry on being different

Helena

Veteran

True that, Mary k! Rock on Diane!

catgirl

Veteran

Can you be authentically ironic?

catgirl

Veteran

I didn't mean that to sound flip! This still fascinates me. As I said in my earlier post on this same topic, I live in a truly "normcore" place - except it's not because no one is paying attention to such things; they (me included, see my weekend photo) are simply and sincerely dressing for their environment.

To me, taking the sincereness factor out inherently makes it an inauthentic simulation and kind of - I don't know - rude, the way appropriating cultural clothing can be. It's one thing to dress appropriately out of respect for the locals or the climate, but to give it a label and make it a Statement? Of course, as Angie says, that is fashion democracy in action.

I think it's even okay to be inauthentic as long as you recognize it and don't try for credibility - then you're in danger of being just plain phony IMHO.

And is imitation the sincerest form of flattery anymore, or something more complex?

Helena

Veteran

Sorry for the short replies - was on my phone and I'm not a good phone-typer.

Mary K - you are absolutely right. Most people are just going with what is around them and their social circles. I guess you can't get more 'team-oriented' than that. I guess I was thinking about certain people I know who eat/dress/vacation/live for the photos they will post on Facebook - but those are a rare few - and I guess if that's who they are authentically, then they are no less authentic than introverted me (except on this forum ha!)

Diane - absolutely! In no way did I mean to say or imply that dressing to express individuality was a bad thing! I am far less expressive and individualistic than many, but far MORE self-conscious - so any criticism was squarely against the likes of myself

Alaskagirl - it's like a Zen koan! I guess it all comes down to different strokes for different folks ...!

Echo

Veteran

If it isn't done intentionally, then it isn't a style statement, IMO; it's just normal life. Like it has been said here, the vast majority of middle America (and I mean that in a general sense, not a locational one) just dresses the way everyone else in their circle does and gets on with things. That isn't a conscious decision either to fit in or to stand out; it is almost unconscious dressing.

My only issue with "normcore" is that it has the potential to make fun of the vast majority of the population. The people dressing that way to be ironic or different or to make a statement are, in many cases, mocking those who dress that way genuinely. With the punk movement, for example, they dressed that way to show they were different and to express their group allegiance. "Normcore" may be a group and may be dressing that way to show allegiance, but the people they are borrowing from are the earnest, genuine people who don't care at all about fashion. They're sometimes being mocked and they won't even "get" it, which those who adopt this trend will probably find all the more hilarious.

As for me, I've mostly liked what I like since way back. Sure, I occasionally adopt some new trends, and the things I really love cycle in and out of fashion, but I see genuine, hardworking people every day who dress "normcore" and don't know it. I will NOT be adopting their clothing styles in order to be ironic at their expense.

catgirl

Veteran

Echo, high five!

Echo

Veteran

I just realized that Una said what I was thinking in a far more succinct way. Oops. Leave it to me to write a novel to express my thoughts!

Janet

(website)

Veteran

Totally agree with Una and Echo!

catgirl

Veteran

Ha! I thought your explanation was much better - was nodding along as I read.

Helena

Veteran

Echo - quite right. That aspect of norm-core has absolutely no appeal to me, and I find it quite off-putting personally, for the reasons you say. I absolutely love seeing people being themselves - whether than means high-fashion, quirky-funky, or sweatshirt and jeans and white sneaks. I feel like a person's 'realness' comes across. In fact the main reason I get SO analytical about my clothes is that I feel out-of-touch with that authenticity for myself - and want to find it again.

I guess the initial article I read downplayed that aspect of it as a take-off on what it was really meant to be about originally - which was about being less about the show of things and more about just being yourself - which made me have a whole other take on the issue. But yes, the whole ironic-dressing thing which takes off the real style of someone else, as if to say "I'm SO cool I can even pull of that guy/girls horrible look" is to me is a bit (sometimes a lot) on the condescending side at best, and ironically (haha) is completely inauthentic in my mind!!

Helena

Veteran

Yikes, I really think I've come across completely wrong!! I am very much not pro-ironic dressing that puts down another!!!

Alaskagirl, your comment: "To me, taking the sincereness factor out inherently makes it an inauthentic simulation and kind of - I don't know - rude, the way appropriating cultural clothing can be."

I couldn't agree more! I guess I (mistakenly!) thought there was a branch of normcore that WAS sincere. That's what I took from that first article I read. But I guess it was not representative of the normcore 'trend' as has been discussed on here before.

rachylou

Veteran

"Normcore" is a new word for me. I've only started seeing it in the past couple of weeks. It sounds to me like hipster (my peeps!) terminology for the new economic reality: Feudalism is back. Keep your head down or lose it. And, btw, the peasant way of life is generally better for the environment...

p.s. Una - was it Woody Allen who talked about real phonies? Was that Annie Hall?

Echo

Veteran

Una, you're always one step ahead! Cultural appropriation, though I wouldn't generally use it about middle America, seems very appropriate here.

rabbit

Veteran

Actually I think alaskagirl's(?) thread on this coincided with a night of bad insomnia for me and I ended up reading K-Hole's whole trend forecast report on normcore and how it differentiates from other youth attitudes/styles like indie. I also read an interview with the K-Hole people that explored it further.

I ended up coming away, on the one hand, thinking that, yes K-Hole are marketers so of course they are going to put a positive/unironic/community/togetherness/inclusiveness spin on it. I think they contrast it with 'acting basic' which is the ironic approach.

On the other hand, I understood what they are saying about what it is like to be young (and probably urban and educated) today, and identified with the idea of 'youth mode'.

Good reading if you are intrigued/puzzled by the idea:

http://bullettmedia.com/articl.....d-freedom/

http://khole.net/ (the 'youth mode' report)

It also offers one explanation (to me at least) as to why UO is carrying Jansport basic backpacks.

IK - I don't think I've ever thought of wearing Tevas as ironic. I just think they are comfortable, period. Why do they need to be pretty if you are wearing them on a trail or kicking around town? Why does one need to be pretty at all if in casual mode unless it's a personal choice? I might be looking at them from a different context though.

Rachey - hipsters are closer to my peeps than any other group out there. The thing is, in my direct experience so far, there is no mocking in the normcore approach. It's like you say, hello economic reality and we're all in this boat together.

karymk

Veteran

I read up on Normcore too. I think everyone on this forum is too "aware" of clothes and fashion to ever be normcore. In fact, it might be a huge effort. I for one know I could never be normcore. For me, my own style mixes and expressions of creativity are what is "normal" for me. To suddenly buy "mom jeans" and white leather sneakers and cotton turtlenecks to be "normal" would be the hugest departure from myself! To wear generic sunglasses from Target is going to make me feel UGLY, not normal.

I guess the norm idea in fashion is actually ANTI-fashion. I think it reflects some current thinking that to be humble and socially on the down-low one should completely forget about clothes as adornment or creative expression, therefore allowing us to focus on more cerebral pursuits, spiritual work, or helping others.

Normcore is an attempt to standout no matter what. By "norming" oneself I think one would be sending a strong message that creative expression and pleasure taken through dress is a shallow, worthless pursuit.

Trying to be "normal" in dress seems just like some new elite way to be self-righteous. How completely non-humble.

Count me out!

catgirl

Veteran

TG, I did not make any assumptions about you at all! I think I had the very same reaction you are having... "This is good, right? Wait a minute..." Thank you for raising it again because I've had more time to think about it since I first posted!

Helena

Veteran

alaska, thank you - I was worried there - I thought, oh no, I sound like a big snobby snot-head a la what Karmyk described (too holier-than-thou for fashion). Glad that's not what came across - and thanks for all your input, I really appreciate your responses and think your points are bang-on

karmyk, quite right - doing something to look like you're "being real" (ironic or not) has got to be the ultimate in fakery. I do admit my sunnies are from Target though, hehe

rabbit, thanks for the links - this is really an interesting topic! Had no idea there was so much to it - hadn't even heard of it until this a.m.

rabbit

Veteran

You know, I think at it's heart, maybe all that young people dressing normcore are saying with their clothes is that as individuals and a society we have bigger fish to fry than worrying about what we're wearing (and when making choices, some 90's nostalgia plays a part because that's when they last felt the world was safe). This goes for Steve Jobs, it goes for Obama, it goes for the underemployed arts graduates, it goes for my family.

Trying to adopt it solely as a clothing trend, especially if you have access to the leisure and financial means to follow designer trends could be ridiculous I agree.

mrseccentric

(website)

Veteran

I have an artist friend who grew up in and lives up near Boise, Idaho (h did spend a decade or two living in the greater SF Bay Area in his twenties/thirties). He has always dressed very very practically/middle american (tee/sweatshirt on top, shorts/sweatpants on the bottom, depending on the weather). Shawn is one of the funniest people i have ever known, very sarcastic and can spot and shoot down any phoney at a quarter mile, i'm not kidding!

So of course i sent him a couple of links on the normcore stuff as soon as i heard about it a week or so ago, figuring it would crack him up and i'd get a line or two of pure Shawn in return. I was not disappointed.

"That normcore was pretty funny. The girl in the first photo is wearing
my hat! I think of my fashion as being more like 'ab-normlcore' from the
Walmart After Dark series."

That line cracked me up and i've been dying to post it here on the forum, but i couldn't think of a way to bring it up - thank you torontogirl

Here's a collage of Shawn's of which i'm particularly fond. Happy Day! steph

This post has 1 photo. Photos uploaded by this member are only visible to other logged in members.

If you aren't a member, but would like to participate, please consider signing up. It only takes a minute and we'd love to have you.

Helena

Veteran

rabbit, I do agree with you - there are some examples that seem genuine that pre-date the normcore label, e.g. Steve Jobs. I've noticed often too, say when you watch science documentaries on TV, the scientists are sometimes wearing dated, or just not-overly-fashionable clothing and I always sort of thought, well I guess if I understood the underpinnings of the universe like that guy does, I guess I wouldn't put much stock in the cut of my shirt either! (I'm sure there are many fashionable scientists, so that's not meant to generalize, but just an observation I've made on occasion).

However, I guess those people have always been around - perhaps normcore-as-trend is appropriating that and thus comes off as highly insincere and in some cases offensive/condescending.

And certainly sincerity can come in the form of high-fashion, if that's what your genuinely into then wearing it is genuine!

12