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"Stupid magpie" vs iconic- finding balance

Anonymous

Brooklyn's saying her teal flares were iconic got me thinking about how I want to approach my statement items, since I decided to move to F5P (French 5 piece).
Here's how I define stupid magpie vs iconic.
Stupid magpie- inexpensive, fun, trendy statements for keeping wardrobe updated.
Iconic-timeless/beyond trend, extra special, $$$ statement pieces.

I decided I want to include both types in my F5P. Too many magpie, I get bored, but too many iconic long lasting pieces would lead to a very statement heavy wardrobe over time because there would be less turnover. Grasshopper is *finally* learning!

"Stupid magpie" pieces I think would be good as shoes, because they tend to wear out quick. Also, probably casual wear would be a good candidate. But I have sooo many magpie pieces that I wouldn't add without removing others. I used to think that accessories were good candidates, but decided otherwise now. Accessories don't wear out. I don't want a drawer full of magpie accessories!

Iconic gets me in trouble. I've had a bad habit of buying low PUPY iconic pieces, especially transitional weather things and dressier things. They're great for jazz concerts, plays, gallery openings, nice restaurants- which I do attend...but Not Often. Maybe 4-5× a year with my current life commitments.
That said, the categories which I think I would like to be iconic statements are: dresses, coats/toppers, good jewelry, bags.
On that note...a tooled leather bag is winging it's way to me

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Stagiaire Fash

Veteran

Do iconic pieces need to be statements? I’m thinking some neutral essentials can be impressive in their simplicity and excellent construction. Hepburn’s cigarette pants, for example, are not show stoppers, but can be worn again & again in all sorts of looks.

Anonymous

No, but for my F5P they will be. I'm giving myself free rein (space permitting) for any simple neutral piece. The F5P is my way of reining in having such a statement heavy wardrobe and lowering my turnover.
ETA- looking through my finds for the year, I have been very good about keeping the statement pieces to a minimum. 5 statements per season may be more than I choose to buy!

Jenn

(website)

Veteran

Ooh, this is good food for thought, and something I'm still trying to find the right balance for, as well.

I've been doing the French Five for years now, and have hit a point where I'm realizing ten statements a year is actually A LOT, especially if you're buying for longevity. That's why I cut back to four statement items (total) this year, but honestly, that's probably not quite enough to stave off boredom and really enjoy getting dressed every day.

The system allows for replacing some statements with "upgraded essentials," which is a direction I've been going recently, but I haven't really been keeping track of which of my essential upgrades would qualify. Honestly, probably none this year. I think all my essential purchases in 2021 have been around or below the $100 threshold. Even if I replaced all my statements with AMAZING essentials, though, it wouldn't solve the problem of wanting to have some fun with fashion.

I think a good example of the balance you speak of might be in my two statement dusters. The Johnny Was duster is the biggest statement in my wardrobe. It's well-made and gorgeously embroidered and I will probably wear it a few times a year, forever. The Anthro duster cost about half what the JW did. The design is printed on, and it's already fading a bit, but I still love it and it will make a statement for me, for as long as it lasts. I love them both, but I'm not deluded that they're equals.

Sure, it would be great if both were iconic, well-made, "forever" pieces, but to be perfectly honest, those pieces don't come around every year, so you treasure them when they do, and find other pieces to enjoy alongside them.

(Okay, this post felt terribly disjointed, and I'm not sure I said anything of use. I'm still working it out, too!)

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Anonymous

I was thinking of you too with this Jenn! If we keep buying these nice quality iconic pieces that last forever, then our wardrobes end up static...and overly statementy cause the pieces add up quickly. In 10 years we'd have 100 at that rate and have no room left for the essentials!

LaPed

Veteran

This is such an intriguing approach! I think F5P makes perfect sense if one of your goals is to streamline your wardrobe and rein in impulsive magpie purchases. You're giving yourself permission to add variety and novelty, but also pushing yourself to identify the right kind of variety and novelty.

I am the opposite of a magpie and have a little bit of an aversion to statement items generally, though I do seem to find enough that integrate seamlessly into my wardrobe that I'm not just wearing a constant rotation of essentials. I *do* like iconic pieces (like Audrey's cigarette pants and mariner tops), and am happy to invest in a piece that has stood/will stand the test of time: Levi's 501s, Doc Martens, pea coats and duffle coats, etc.

I can't say that statements ever take up a huge chunk of my budget. I want my essentials to stand up to years of heavy, ongoing wear and am willing to pay for quality when it comes to things like black jeans, cotton knitwear, outerwear, etc. Fun statement pieces may only get a few outings per year and I am happier if I can get away with cheap-and-cheerful for low-PUPY pieces. It's also easier to find statement-y pieces on clearance racks and at thrift stores IME. The core neutral version of an item is far less likely to get discounted at the end of the season than the limited edition prints/colours. Likewise, the core neutral pieces in people's wardrobes seem to withstand closet edits, while wildcard items are often the first to go (boredom, orphans, etc), so thrift and consignment are often a good source for statements. For instance, my "mountain-formal" wedding guest outfit for later this month may turn out to be 100% secondhand, depending on the weather...

Suz

(website)

Veteran

This is so interesting to me, as someone who is considering this 5 piece French thing. For years, I couldn't get my head around it at all, but I realized that was partly because I hadn't figured out my style enough and hadn't really built my wardrobe. And then, the second "problem" was that I tend in the opposite direction -- i.e. if left to my own devices, I buy mostly boring neutrals (some high quality, but still). Which -- of course-- is precisely the reason a system like this could be valuable to me, because it would encourage me to focus on statements!! And to rotate them, perhaps, once I was getting bored.

None of this is relevant to your original point, however! But I'm getting there. And what I want to say is that I can really see the wisdom in this approach. Not every statement can be an iconic "keep it for a decade or more" item -- because yep, that would lead to serious boredom for me, too.

I'm going to have to go away and think about my own balance now and figure out what pieces can be what you call "magpie" purchases. Footwear might count for me by default, too, simply because I wear out my shoes really fast and often do make footwear a statement or trend piece of the outfit. Hmmmm. Thank you for some food for thought!

slim cat

Veteran

I don't think I can do 5 items french approach and I like magpie pieces in my wardrobe - graphic tees and tank tops mostly.
My statement pieces are used for my dressy work since special occasion isn't happening for me since like forever ( last 5-6 years at least ).
I want my statement pieces to be something in between - $-$$ in price
( not $$$ ), and suitable for nice meeting with friends/work/family gathering but not opera/ballet/high end restaurant. That means no formal dresses, no sequined outfits, no heels, no amazing coats - but separates that I can dress up or down and metallic shoes to add some special feeling.
Figuring out what works for you is the most important step, since we are all unique in our special way. I look forward to your next step - finding the right iconic pieces and modeling some of them.

Anonymous

Glad to get everyone thinking I definitely don't need super formal statement pieces either (unfortunately). The magpie stuff is generally workwear, since thats where I spend the most time, and I buy the fun stuff to cheer myself up.
I don't think I want to thrift much for statements- though it seems logical. No Snow Queen coat will show up in my town- I guarantee it! Just last season's outlet stuff mostly :p
You definitely have statements Suz! Your plaids in particular are what come to mind.

Brooklyn

Veteran

What I meant by that is that I’m trying to divide my wardrobe into “iconic” vs “everyday”. The idea is “iconic” are pieces that last and can be worn a lot over time vs everyday pieces are pieces that are worn frequently but for a shorter period of time.

Iconic doesn’t have to be statement. But it has to have some timeless qualities and elements that I’m confident I won’t tire of quickly. It could just be a plain coloured blazer or skirt in a colour that I consistently gravitate to. Doesn’t have to be spendy but it can justify a spend, if that makes sense. And definitely doesn’t have to be special occasion wear (I count my ombré jacket as iconic, and it’s a workhorse for me) but it can justify a purchase as special occasion wear, as long as you don’t let that category become too large.

The idea is that “iconic” is the backbone of my wardrobe. The everyday wear are the working limbs.

Iconic possibilities: pants, jackets, coats, bags, jewellery, some dresses and skirts, some blouses.

Everyday items: jeans, knits, tees, layering tops, shoes, shorts.

Trendy items are fine, but I want them to be items that I wear a lot (everyday items). For me jeans would be a good trend purchase because that’s an item I could easily wear out within 2 years. But a trendy blazer (for my lifestyle) could be a mistake because it won’t be an everyday item. I could end up passing it on in a few years when the trend passes and without having racked up a lot of wear. If I want a blazer, I should look for iconic qualities instead.

So, in fact, an everyday item could be a statement piece and/or a trendy piece.

Does that help?

rachylou

Veteran

I feel like… ‘uh oh, this is deep.’ Lol. I need a deep think about my magpie pieces and how I go about acquiring them, their place in the scheme of things…

Anonymous

Interesting! I wear statementy pieces for normal wear, but usually the cheaper less timeless ones. Your wardrobe looks like better quality, more intentional, more iconic statement pieces than most of mine! I was inspired to move my wardrobe more in that direction, but realized I just don't have the life to sustain it. Hence- the need for balance!

Re: jeans I'm the opposite. I don't think I've ever worn out a pair! Timeless for me there

Oh and I was referring just to statements here. I'm thinking of my other pieces as classics, at least the neutral ones. I guess fairly simple colored pieces are another category.

ETA- how about Timeless Quality Statements vs the stuff I picked up on a whim at the outlets

Jaime

(website)

Veteran

Hmm, lots of food for thought. Here are some of my random ones:
Jumping ahead in time for F5Pers, and as a person with a lot of statement pieces, I like to rotate them in and out of actual use. I do this naturally - some years I am feeling certain bags, shoes and jackets/coats more than others. One advantage of a large wardrobe is my statements last as long as I want.
If I think about my most used and beloved items I do think retail purchases are a bit overrepresented compared to second hand. This is primarily shoes - as my feet get older and less tolerant I find myself more tempted to streamline my shoedrobe and buy new.
Bags and jewelry make a lot of sense for the iconic category.
Still thinking...

Brooklyn

Veteran

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with picking up inexpensive trendy or statement things on a whim at the outlets, as long as you plan to wear them a lot. What I’m looking to avoid is the trendy item that doesn’t get worn a lot and then gets passed on within a couple of years (and because it’s off trend probably ends up at recycling or in landfill).

But even in my inexpensive and/or trendy items, I look for quality, especially in fabrication. I don’t hold with buying cute acrylic jumpers that I know will pill within a dozen wears or so, for instance. I think quality items hold up to a lot of wear.

This skirt for instance. I would call it an everyday item because I wear it at least 2 times a week in summer. It’s a trendy piece (shirring, check print). Not iconic but it is a statement piece. It’s tencel and it’s stood up to a lot of washing (summer stuff gets washed a lot). Apart from a slight relaxation in the shirring, it’s in great shape after 3 summers of hard wear.

So maybe try to be picky about the quality of your statement items? (Not trying to lecture you or anyone else here. I am definitely not the person to be giving lessons in wardrobe management!)

Stagiaire Fash

Veteran

You don’t have the lifestyle to sustain better quality, more intentional pieces? I don’t understand. Do you mean financially?

What you define as a problem—building a wardrobe of iconic statement pieces large enough that you can rotate them in and out according to your mood—is exactly what I think would be the goal and the way to stop the repeated quick hits of trendy stuff that gets old/worn/tiresome quickly. I have no idea if anyone would call my clothes “iconic”, but that strategy is exactly what I use. I’ve posted a lot of WIWs this year, almost none of them the “I wore my new x” variety. Creativity comes in wearing the same item different ways from time to time and mixing pieces from different seasons/eras. But I do agree with you & Jenn that ten a year is a fast pace.

ETA Brooklyn (writing at the same time as I was) makes a great point about trendy—it doesn’t have to mean disposable or poor quality. Even outlet stores can have good quality merch.

slim cat

Veteran

What Brooklyn wrote helped me to differentiate between my moto jackets: All Saints black leather as iconic and couple much less expensive ones from Kut of the Kloth and BR Factory as "magpie" items. They are nice but I don't expect the same level of fit/comfort/style as my fav leather one.
I think I don't have enough of true iconic items for now - it takes time and effort to find the right ones.
Thank you for starting this conversation and for adding personal thoughts/ideas - it helps!

Sal

Veteran

I understand your thoughts Suntiger - I can also be drawn to the fun items.

I am trying a version of the 5PFW- my goal is to reduce my purchasing and focus. Of my winter additions that I consider to be my five pieces - the shoes are possibly not a real statement. But I didn't feel that they were essential either (like upgrading my straight jeans or my cognac bag). I would say that they are all somewhat "in fashion" but probably the pink sweater feels like the piece that might date or I might tire of the quickest.

I haven't yet worn my dress and this is likely to be a piece with low PUPY (how many times can you wear a dress with cape sleeves and a sheer skirt?). But I also see it is fun, it is nice quality, and not especially "of the moment".

In terms of iconic pieces that I will always hold onto, there are less than I might hope. Maybe only the last four finds (my black sheath, my jade green Argentinian sandals, my blazer and my kimono).

To be iconic I think top quality (not necessarily expensive) and very much in keeping with your style persona. That doesn't mean classic, but just perfect for you. Jenn's statement duster is iconic for her, but might not be for someone else, as with Brooklyn's teal flares.

I think bags are a good candidate for icons as are jackets and blazers and dresses (for some of us).

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Anonymous

Biggest issue for me with my wardrone is space- my closet is tiny. There's not really any place to store and rotate items. Even my garage is stuffed with everything from FILs house :/

When I say my lifestyle can't sustain having a bunch of great statement pieces, I mean my activities. My daily life is mostly work, helping family, and being outside to reset from the rest. I'd love to buy beautiful arty things in silk and velvet- those gallery opening/jazz concert/theatre kinda things. I just haven't had time to do those things much. And TBH those are night events and I am not a night person. At All. 5am I'm good, 5pm not so much!
Maybe I just need to think of a "cultural event" capsule for the iconic type statements!
Will respond more later

Star

Veteran

Brooklyn everything you have written makes so much sense. Lightbulb going on for me is that something worn less often should not be trendy. Your example of a blazer rather being in a classic shape/colour is spot on for me too. This is a golden nugget of information for going forward for me!

Sal

Veteran

I think a cultural event capsule is a great idea! I also agree with your outdoorsy lifestyle and work that “events” wear is not a big part of the lifestyle. Potentially there can be crossover eg Birkenstocks, a knit dress that can be worn for work with sandals or to see family with slides.

Stagiaire Fash

Veteran

I see. We are saying different things with “well made, more intentional”. I don’t mean “fancy”; I think those descriptors can apply to many fabrics.
Are magpie pieces the ones that give you a little thrill when you put them on? I would think your PC clothes would too. They’re too expensive to stock up on, but having a few in your closet could give you a little fun wow feeling when you pull them out. Wear it to work a few times, launder it, and move onto something else, until you rediscover that PC thing another time.

Anonymous

My workwear definitely crosses over to weekends- and the dressier workwear to the cultural events, like my LBDs. I just like having something a little more "extra" for those events
Now I'm thinking maybe when I can change jobs I should work part time outside and part time at a gallery!
My PC things do go to work. They're good options for the iconic statements!

Where is the sun???? It's almost 6:30 and I want to SUP!!!

nemosmom

Veteran

This requires a deep think for me! I’ve entertained the idea of French 5, but couldn’t quite get the logistics right in my head… are “iconic” pieces the items that could also be defined as “signature” pieces?

Does a statement piece have to be flashy to be considered a statement?

Can my essential olive pullover be considered iconic even though it’s very boring and plain?

If icons = signature pieces, is my $$$ waxed Barbour utility jacket more iconic than my $ thrifted Levi’s one?

This will require more coffee

Irina

Veteran

I had to think about it. What would be “iconic “ for me? Probably, something that is definitely outside of trends but not necessarily classic in style. High quality, for sure and something must be special about the item like print, cut, fabric. These will be the clothes I want to keep (and fit into) forever.
I have only a few pieces like, I’m still trying to identify which ones fit into this category and why.
I have known for a while that my closet is full of good quality, functional clothes. But it is hardly special.
I’m all set with more clothes then I need and from now on plan to add only iconic to me, pieces. Easily said than done.

CarolS

Veteran

This is an interesting thread, and I'm intrigued by the French 5 concept and the question of what makes something 'iconic'. Please forgive if I repeat things that have already been said - I've been skimming the conversation over the past couple of days, but might have missed some points.

Steve Jobs black turtleneck was iconic to him, but certainly not unique or special. Earlier in the thread I think Audrey Hepburn's cigarette pants were mentioned -- another iconic item that isn't necessarily unique or special in an obvious way, other than how it remains so closely identified with her style. We think of them when we see those items.

I think a personally iconic piece CAN be special and "statement"-y (I think of Brooklyn's amazing skirts), but to my way of thinking about it, iconic doesn't necessarily equal statement, IYKWIM?

So, person one's iconic pieces might be black turtlenecks, sleek boots and Levi's 501s and person two's could be fit and flare dresses, pink shoes and hoop earrings. Person two could also own a black turtleneck, and person one could own a fit and flare dress, but these items are not iconic to them but they are classic items that still serve a purpose in their wardrobes.

I think I am getting a bit convoluted, so like Nemosmom, I'm going to continue to ponder these concepts over more coffee....

rachylou

Veteran

Ok this is as far as I’ve gotten: by and large I don’t carry purses, but I have a few. My Gucci is iconic and I’ve had it over 30 years. My Target is magpie. And I really should not buy another bag of either kind…

Anonymous

This is a very interesting thread and has given me lots to think about . I do think of the word *iconic* in a slightly different way but that’s not important here . An aside - I have found my most statement-y pieces to be the most costly , and that right there is a problem . Lots of $$ tied up in very expensive blazers , leather jackets etc that not get worn once in awhile . Maybe the statement-y / fun pieces need to be less important than that for me . Thanks for this thread !

Jenn

(website)

Veteran

One thing that I think gets lost in the French 5 is that what qualifies as an essential is really only very specific, predefined items, so anything outside that is a “statement,” including pieces that Angie might call “completers.”

I like Brooklyn’s idea that both essentials and statements can be iconic. And things like jeans and layering tees are more everyday. I have some everyday statements, too, like my floral blouses and some of my colored linen pieces.

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Sal

Veteran

It’s what makes it fun - the variety of styles and tastes. I love this aspect of the forum- when I see a blouse and think it looks like Bijou’s style or a elegant white ensemble that reminds me of Joy.

I have defined my core staple wardrobe. Most are essentials but not all. I think the goal of the 5PFW is to focus your shopping on pieces of quality but to allow room for experimentation and joy. This is my first year so I am no expert/ my goal is to add pieces thoughtfully.

Sloper

Veteran

A very interesting thread.

I think 5PFW can be a useful concept. For me, an intuitive (ok emotional) shopper I could see this working as a means of discipline. No scattershot shopping throughout the year. Adding a statement only with the seasons - 4x a year. And now that I'm not working, and my external activities are constrained for the foreseeable future - to examine purchases much more carefully - and questioning my need for "statements" anymore.

And a little rant:
If only they didn't call it "French"
I kinda feel like it's the fashion industry pushing my buttons: "Slap the word "French" on it! That makes it special - Americans love French women!" Whatever it is called, it's a good common sense idea. Though I wonder if "they" (the fashion powers that be) mean for it to be way of me constraining my shopping instead of buying more.

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