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Should we insist DS attend IB school?

Windchime

Veteran

Our son was accepted into a top school for 8th grade next year. If he went, he'd stay for high school. The school uses the International Baccalaureate curriculum. I am thrilled about this opportunity for him. He, however, doesn't want to go because none of his friends are there. His strengths are math and science; he's talking about possibly going into engineering someday. Writing is not easy for him, and the IB school has a big emphasis on writing. Of course DH and I could insist that he go. If we did, this would be the first significant conflict we've had with DS.

Above all else, I want him to be happy, and he is happy at his current school, which also goes through high school. But I also hate to see him decline this opportunity--competition is intense for this IB school.

We've been thinking about this all week, writing pros and cons lists, etc. The final decision needs to be made by tomorrow (Friday) morning. Do any of you have experience with IB schools? Or wisdom about 8th grade boys? He's our only child.

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26 replies

Latest reply was from MsMary

Glory

Veteran

I don't have any direct experience with IB schools. I do have 3 children. My feeling is that happiness trumps academics and therefore is the most important thing. That being said, fear of change is not a good reason not to try. I do wonder about the extra work load and whether he would enjoy it, would it give him time for other activities. My DD in grade 9 opted not to do the gifted program in Math and Science and still has about 3 hours of homework each night. Honestly I find it excessive. I think that balance is everything and she should have time for school but also for sports and other activities. For what it is worth,I let her make the decision on the gifted program. Sorry I know this isn't that helpful.

Kristin SF

Veteran

Congratulations to your son on this achievement!

Since he is strong in math and science, it's likely that the emphasis on writing in this new school would make him an even stronger candidate for schools, jobs down the road. I work with a lot of engineers who can't write to save their lives. Engineers who can express themselves clearly are usually in leadership positions.

Would your son respond to a compromise? Could he try the new school for 1 year? Is there any way to meet incoming students now, to ease the transition?

Best of luck to you all on this big decision. It's a tough one, for sure.

catgirl

Veteran

What was the reason he applied? Did he expect to get in and have a plan for that? We have let DS stay at his school and not move to a more elite school he got into because of friends and also exposure to more diversity. But he is only 10. I would only make the change if you honestly felt it was an advantage he truly can't understand. If he gets it and still doesn't want to go then I think he will resent it in the end. My 2 cents....

Liz A.

Veteran

The IB school in my city focused on the humanities, and I went to the math and science school. How are the academics at his other choice school? Can he still take the coursework he will need for his college apps and career path? Do they have APs or whatever course offerings will challenge him? If so, then maybe the IB will not be so important. My parents teach at an IB school. The one cool thing that probably wouldn't interest your son, but maybe, is that I think IB courses can be accepted internationally.

JAileen

Veteran

The IB school here has a great reputation. Kids that do well there have more opportunities for scholarships. I agree that writing skills separate the men from the boys, or the women from the girls, or whatever. Wherever he goes, he going to need to work on writing. I guess I'm not much help, sorry.

Windchime

Veteran

I have to leave shortly and won't able to log in for several hours.

Glory--you sound like a wise and well-balanced mother.

Kristin--thank you for that insight about engineers. I read that to DS. I, too, am wondering about insisting that he try it for one year, with the option to go back to his current school at the end.

Alaskagirl--that's a very perceptive question. He applied mostly because we'd talked about how it's always good to have options.

Liz A-- the academics at his current school are okay--not great and not terrible. He has the opportunity there to take high-school and eventually college courses early and is doing so with his math. I don't think they offer AP courses. I really appreciate your weighing in, since your parents teach in an IB school!

Anonymous

I went to an IB high school and mostly had a great experience. That said, it's a lot of work and I think a kid has to be self-motivated to some degree to really thrive. And I remember that, at that age, not feeling comfortable socially makes it harder to focus on much else. I'd let him make the final decision, with maybe an agreement that, if he sticks with his current school, he has to work with you to find other opportunities to stretch himself rather than entirely taking the easy path.

DonnaF

Veteran

Has your son done many things where he has gone or done something where he hasn't known anyone else? I'm thinking sleep away camp, science camp, youth orchestra, club soccer, that type of things. If yes, you can point to those things and how he may have been possibly hesitant at first and then how he made lots of friends. Now, if he's not venturesome that way and is very slow to warm up, that's another matter. Any way he can meet other admittees?

You know your kid, and the importance to him of stretching his intellect vs. his social boundaries. I have observed that for some boys, if they aren't intellectually challenged and see homework assignments as useless they will disengage and otherwise act out. Girls tend to me more compliant towards (boring) demands.

My sense is that IB schools are probably more exam oriented than project oriented, much less group project oriented. Will this work for your kid?

FWIW, I have a daughter whom I thought was an introvert for many, many years. She didn't say a word in Sunday school until she was at least in second grade although she went weekly so knew the teachers and other kids. Over the years and with experience, she grew more and more outgoing and opted to attend a college where she didn't know a soul. In fact, those are the type of colleges she wanted to attend!

Vildy

Veteran

I think Harry Stack Sullivan was brilliant on boys and he felt the strongest plus a young boy could have is a good friend. It would see him through. I'd count friendship as a huge plus.

Sarah A

Veteran

I attended an IB school and was one of 15 in my class to do the entire IB diploma as opposed to just subject matter tests. It was work, but I feel it prepared me well for college (US AIr Force Academy) and instilled good habits and study skills. I always played at least one and usually two sports per season and never felt like the homework was beyond what was manageable. Hard yes, but we did study groups and such to make it do-able. Contrary to DonnaF's impression our classes were very very project focused and although that may just be a product of the particular school I attended the IB requirements include a research project and community service for the diploma so there is indeed a focus on "whole" person development too. We never really got ready for "the test" it was just a week you knew was coming at the end of school so you took good notes and reviewed them (often in groups). Very similar to my college courses really in that regard. Interestingly enough just a few hours ago DH and I were lamenting that we dont have an IB school option here for our children and talking about putting together a parent group and lobbying the school board to see if we can get the program added here by the time our children would be that age. I guess you can gather my opinion.... I do think trying to determine why he is hesitant and addressing those issues to the best of your ability would be a good route.

chouette22

Veteran

My son graduated from an IB school two years ago. It was an incredible experience for him. There were many international kids (this is our case as well) and a fabulous diversity. Most students were incredibly motivated and focused, and the curriculum was very, very demanding. He had been a really good student up to that point, but this school brought the absolute best out of him. The amazing mix of motivated kids just made him work so much harder, and let me tell you, there were HOURS of homework every single day. But they really teach the kids how to study.

My daughter, 3 years younger, didn't want to go to this school once she saw how much work was required. We insisted that she try to get in nonetheless, we wanted to see if she passed the lottery stage (once you pass the lottery, you have to pass an admission test as well). She was not successful in the lottery, and I think this spared us a very tough decision. For her, this school was probably not a good match, as she is rather a minimalist when it comes to her work ethic. She does well in the high school she goes to (which has a good ranking too), but the difference between what is demanded of her and what was demanded of my son are worlds apart. I often ask myself if she had been as complacent, had she gone to the IB school? She compares herself to her friends and they feel that they are doing just fine, but compared to what my son learned, it's a staggering difference. Her study skills are not as developed as they should be, in my mind, however she is getting o.k. grades. The work load is much lighter. My son got into an excellent university and is doing pre-med now. He got 28 credits transferred from the IB school and basically began as a Sophomore. Also, the transition to the university was very easy as he already had all the required study skills and self-motivation.

I wish you luck with your decision. I think your son was given an amazing opportunity. He'll have it easy with the sciences, but there is definitely a strong focus on writing, which becomes easier the more you have to do it, so keep that in mind as well.

carter

Veteran

When it was time for my kids to apply for schools in 6th grade, I held veto rights on the schools to which they wanted to apply, but I let them make the decision once the acceptances came in. I really feel like both kids picked the exact right schools. My daughter chose a small girls' school (no Friday football...I almost cried!), but she totally blossomed in the setting. She graduates from Pepperdine next month, so not chosing one of our local top two schools didn't do her any harm and is totally irrelevant now. My son elected to go to the #2 school (fierce rival of the #1 school I attended, so again, I cringed), but it's perfect for him, and I'm as happy with his choice as he is. If I had to do it over again, I would do the same thing, but I have to say it was a bit nerve-racking to give them so much control over their own lives at such a young age. Nobody knows your son better than the three of you (you, DH and DS). Whatever you choose will be the best possible decision for him.

MsMary

Veteran

I took my son out of a school in which he had great friends when he was halfway through high school. I'm not sure I'd make the same decision again. School is important but a good group of friends is priceless.

But beyond, that, I don't think the question is "Which decision is best?" The question is "Who gets the final say?" And honestly, I think by 8th grade, assuming both alternatives are acceptable (which it sounds like they are in this case), he should have the final say after having all the pro's and con's laid out for him.

abc

Veteran

Thanks for this discussion. My two little ones are years away from decisions like this but I'm just becoming aware of the IB program - it's great to hear some firsthand accounts.

Good luck on your decision. No wisdom or advice here, sorry.

Adelfa

Veteran

Both my girls got their IB diploma. I mildly discouraged both of them from going but the oldest wanted to go because her friends were going, and the younger one wanted to go to keep up with the older one.

There is tons of practice writing and researching. I think as a result of IB college was super easy for both of them, even though they went to top schools. However they were both more inclined towards the humanities and from what I've seen IB doesn't do any favors for math and science inclined kids.

They had so much work it just made me cry. I hated it. I didn't agree with it. No kid should have that much work.

So I have two thoughts about your son. One is that he'd probably be better off academically, given his interests, at the non-IB school and supplementing with college courses. Two is that it is my personal opinion that no kid should be asked to work that hard. If they want to ask it of themselves, that's another thing. And friends, as MaryK says, are priceless.

One more thought for you. There are a lot of ways to be successful, and a lot of ways for kids to grow up to be happy and self-sufficient. So often as parents we worry about finding the one best way. But kids tend to surprise us by finding their own great ways.

Good luck!

Gaylene

Veteran

I totally agree with MaryK.

I've worked with students from IB schools, private schools, home schools, specialty schools, and public schools, and can't honestly say that any of these routes offer a guarantee of success in the post-secondary environment from my observations. Different programs suit different kids. On the other hand, I have also worked with students who I worried about because they seemed so focused on grades and living up to parental expectations that it actually impeded their learning at university; they were tense, anxious, upset, and fragile if they couldn't immediately grasp a concept or had trouble with assignments. Learning wasn't a joy, but a constant struggle.

Academics are important, but so are friends and happiness. The best students that I've taught at university were ones who laughed with friends, worked diligently on their assignments, coped well with the occasional disappointment, and enjoyed learning about new ideas. No school has the exclusive on developing these traits in a child. I'd say talk to your son about the pros and cons but I'd be careful about being too insistent about doing something that you want but he resists.

Jeanie

Veteran

Our high school has an IB program but as the others have said it's not for everyone. I think it requires a strong work ethic and a lot of passion for academics and commitment to work outside of school. It does lean toward the Humanities. My son may do an IB German class his Senior year but we are in agreement that he is not suited to the work ethic required for the whole diploma. He is having a lot of stress just keeping up with his honors and AP classes. I think it is a good program for the kids that are suited to the intensity as it makes the student more well rounded and the diploma can help you get into college. Friends are immensely important at this age. I see how much influence my son's friends have on him and luckily for us he has a good group of friends. If he didn't have such good support in his friends he wouldn't want to go to school. You know your son the best but I wouldn't trade a good group of friends for an IB program. I am not a school advisor, but if he doesn't like the writing and is inclined to do engineering maybe the IB program isn't the best fit.

I stressed so much over these academic decisions with our first son. We want the best for them and worry about putting them on the right path. You are doing the right thing by gathering all the information and then you just have to do what you think is right for your child.

Windchime

Veteran

We've decided to have him continue in his current school. That old axiom kept going through my head, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Thank you so very much to all who took the time to reply. I was surprised by how many responded to this. I'm touched by the thought, wisdom, common sense, and caring that came through in the responses. I really appreciate reading about your own decisions regarding alternate schools and IB schools in particular. And I appreciate the wisdom of those who observed that, no matter what school he attends, it will all work out in the end. (A good thing to keep in mind a few years down the road when he applies to colleges!)

This decision was tough for me because I would have jumped at this opportunity when I was DS's age. I loved language and writing and excelled at humanities courses. But I've had to step back and try as best I can to see what is best for DS, who is cut from different cloth. Another parenting lesson learned...

April

Veteran

I'm also agreeing with MK. An eighth-grader is old enough to have a strong voice in the decision. He's the one who's going to carry the burden of it for the next four years, right? It's hard to see a great reason to insist on something he's not excited about.

"Competition is intense" is the worrisome phrase for me -- you wouldn't want him to feel burned out by the time it's time for college, and that seems more likely if he's not fully on board about the choice in the first place.

Unless your local high school is a really bad environment for one reason or another, you may be surprised by what's available there. Our town is neither large nor wealthy, yet my son can and does take AP courses in an astonishing array of subjects. He's learned to navigate socially (after attending a tiny, hands-on, child-friendly private school from K through 6th) and decide which friends are good to have and which you want to avoid. Very valuable skills to have before he goes out into the world.

Sarah A

Veteran

Great advice here. Ill add that i didnt find the IB math challenging. I took math through a University program in my city starting in 8th grade. I had to take the IB SL course to take the test but it was just reviewing concepts i had done years earlier. The emphasis on writing helped me write lab reports in my science and engineering courses with much more ease than my college classmates in engineering.

Sarah A

Veteran

Cross posted! I hope to have as much wisdom making choices with my children as you demonstrate here.

Sona

Veteran

My brother went to an IB school and thanks to that he finished college in three years. it was a lot of work but because he was given college credit for math, economics, English,etc college was only 3 years and my parents saved a bunch of money thanks to that. So there is also the question of college and college costs, to consider. While giving him the option he should also know the benefits of 'acing it' at an IB school.

Jenava

(website)

Veteran

I was able to graduate college in three years due to taking college classes in lieu of HS classes (my HS did not offer AP and I don't know what IB is!).

I have to say, at this point (my mid 30's) I actually wish I had been able to attend college for four years. college isn't only about the academics. I missed a year with the closest group of friends I'd ever had to that point which was a big loss. Sure, I saved a year on tuition, but in the long run it wasn't worth it for me.

ETA, not to mention, I missed out on a year of education (which i suppose technically I already had, but maturity-wise I'm not sure I got what I could have out of it) and instead was in the workforce, which wasn't as production, personally, as school would have been (entry-level job vs. another year at an incredible, small liberal arts college with a group of insanely smart & creative fellow students. Seems like a no-brainer now...)

Just my two cents, in case the college credit was a factor for you. It sounds like you've made a good decision.

Adelfa

Veteran

Just a note--some colleges do offer a full year of credit for an IB diploma. But DD2 got 12 units and DD1 got zero. So it all depends.

Neel

Veteran

IB is one of the most sought after curriculums I guess. I had a choice of putting DS (primary) in either IB or UK curriculum. I settled for the latter, simply because I was not sure if I was ready to pressurize DS with the homework overload. I am glad I did because DS turned out to be a slow learner and is blossoming in this school. May not be the best curriculum .... but he is happy and not pressurized.

Please don't change his school if he is against it. I wouldn't have liked it if my parents did that and probably would have done bad in exams on purpose just to teach them a lesson. Lol! Tough being a parent ..... Tougher being a child!

MsMary

Veteran

I'm glad it worked out! Good for you, Mom!