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OT: Fear of animals?

catgirl

Veteran

I have a wee problem... a close friend's young daughter is completely animal-phobic. We are talking absolute terrified hysterical meltdown levels. This means she can't come to our pet-infested home, nor can she go many places in this state of dog-lovers. It is utterly incomprehensible to me that someone with no traumatic experiences or taught preconceptions would fear animals naturally (at least dogs and cats!).

I have several bizarre fears, including a very strange, inexplicable and rare one (trypophobia, fear of naturally occurring multiple holes like honeycombs and lotus seed pods) so I get the irrational aspect of it, but I just don't know how to cope with a child who screams at the sight of our dog (who is herself the most timid and gentle soul)!

Does anyone here in this group of animal lovers have this particular phobia or experience in how to handle such a phobia?

General

49 replies

Latest reply was from ManidipaM

nicoleb

(website)

Veteran

I hate snakes. I break down in tears when i see one or try to pass out. Not at a pet store in a cage but like, out loose. To handle it...I...just...try not to go where snakes go. So..no advice.... :-/

Did something happen to her to make her so afraid of dogs? It's honestly probably something she just has to work out in her own time. Maybe take her to a pet store where she could look a puppies through the glass? Or can she not handle that either?

Poor kid.

catgirl

Veteran

She has never had a bad experience that her parents are aware of, and she is only 6 years old. Even she can't articulate what is going on. Thanks for sharing your feelings, it helps me to get how little she can help it. So hard not to feel personally put out on behalf of Kona, but I know it's not the poor child's fault.

Mochi

Veteran

Some of my childhood phobias have greatly diminished (driving over bridges); some, not as much (Fear of heights). But neither would, I'm thinking, have such a debilitating Impact on quality of life as a terror of such a commonplace and beloved creature like a dog or cat. To my mind, this would need to be worked out professionally. It shouldn't be mishandled, underestimated or left to chance that she'll simply outgrow it.

(iPhone post w errors)

Aziraphale

Veteran

I can't offer an explanation, but there is hope for this child, and for future playtime at your house. The irrational fear can gradually be overcome.

One of my daughter's preschool friends was irrationally terrified of dogs, and the one time he came over to our house (when he was four or five), he spent the entire time sitting on a bar stool to keep out of reach of our dog (who, by the way, is gentle and quite small). His parents couldn't understand his fear. Neither of them are afraid of animals, although they don't have any pets. Well, this kid's next-door neighbours got a very sweet golden retriever, and over the past several years he has seen quite a lot of that dog. He now plays with it and is quite attached to it, and his mom told me that his general fear of dogs is greatly diminished.

So gradual, repeated exposure to (friendly, gentle) animals is probably the way to go.

Claudia

Veteran

I'd say that it would really benefit this girl to get professional help. This kind of fear response can cause her to actually become an animal target, and also limit her activities, freedom and enjoyment in many environments for a lifetime if she isn't able to loose the phobia and control her response, even if she never feels completely comfortable and becomes an animal lover..

This particular phobia is very important to address early for those reasons, and if this was my child, I'd get help.

Mochi

Veteran

PS: I know what you're trying to say and think it's great that you're trying to help a friend, and this is perhaps nitpicking, but this isn't realty *your* problem. Just saying, because we women often feel like we need to solve everything. Though again, I think it's awesome of you to help your friend.

Transcona Shannon

Veteran

Oh poor Kona - I hope she's not taking it personally! How could those sweet eyes frighten anyone?

But seriously...if this is a fear not based on any sort of past incident or experience, it might be worthwhile for her parents to take her to a professional to discuss. The longer she feels the way she does, the harder it may be for her to reduce that fear.

I'm afraid of the dark .... yes at age 49....but I blame my older brothers who played all sorts of pranks on me when I was little to terrify me in the dark!

catgirl

Veteran

Elizabeth, Claudia and Mochi, thanks for the input! I know her parents are baffled but don't think they will go as far as therapy. Mochi, you are right and thank you! For me it's really a question of how much to cater to her fear by kicking the dog outside or locking up the cat vs. letting her be around them even if she is shrieking on a table (which scares the pets too!). And it's uncomfortable socially for her mom to be at our house - torn between always either shooing the dog away or comforting her unhappy daughter. Good point about becoming a target, Claudia - I know my dogs are always right in the face of a crying child, usually to give kisses, but I know some dogs react aggressively to fearful behavior.

My mother is not an animal person at all. She grew up being told that dogs bite and give rabies (probably quite true back in rural India) and has never loved her furry grandbabies. But the rest of us are mad about animals and just can't relate.

Elly

Veteran

Hmm is it all animals and all dogs? It is possible she did get exposed to a dog that even if not badly behaved freaked her out in some way-- my brother thought pugs were terrifying as child because he thought their eyes were going to pop out. Someone could have even said something to her about dogs at preschool, daycare, or school. Maybe she saw something dead in the back of a hunter's vehicle or road killed that freaked her out. I dated a man once that had come across a dead animal as a child and couldn't stand to deal with dead animals because he felt like they were evil and watching him (talk about irrational!). Dogs sometimes have mostly black or dark eyes, which sometimes freak kids out. Maybe grandma or grandpa or even mom or dad had warned her about animals instead of specifically warning her about approaching wild animals or animals like bears.

If the girl is otherwise fairly normal functioning and doesn't have other fears her parents might consider experimenting, like talking about how great dogs are, giving her stuffed dogs to play with, taking her to a pet store like Nicole mentioned (or a doggy obedience school), ect. I would suggest other animals, but well-trained dogs are about the only animal I can think of that is guaranteed not to bite and least likely to freak out if she gets rough or freaks out. A bunny might be another one that is less likely to bite or scare her, but they can have their nerves shattered.

My close friend's daughter is 4 and we thought she was afraid of dogs, but then she met a hardy little small dog that was very very well behaved and used to kids. It turns out the bigger and more rambunctious dogs had overwhelmed her. She now carries that little dog around (poor dog!) and is warming up to the bigger dogs.

catgirl

Veteran

Elly, great points. It's not just dogs for this child, it's also cats - so not a size issue. We praise her any time she manages to keep it together if the cat walks by or accidentally brushes her. Obviously we can't know everything she's seen or heard, so you could be right - even a book or TV show could be the cause. Or maybe there is no explanation. Phobias are such mysterious things - they MUST be related to unconscious instincts, however misguided.

RoseandJoan

Veteran

I would maybe try keeping Kona in another room, whilst letting your friends daughter know that she is there. Then eventually asking her if she would mind if Kona is brought into the room on a lead. If she accepts this you could ask her is would like to stroke Kona whilst she is on the lead. I think it is important that she remains in control and if she says no it is not pursued.

DD has autism and has many fears which require lots of detective work to get to the root cause. If this was my daughter I would be asking, is it the smell? Is it the unpredictable movement? Is it the occasional loud noise? Has the fear been inadvertently reinforced? Is there a common denominator amongst the animals she fears, are they all large, white or jumpy?

I hope the visit goes smoothly.

rachylou

Veteran

She's six? She could have easily had a bad experience with a dog when no one saw. Both kids and animals are quick, and quick to offend each other. Or it could just be the young mind - synaptic pathways forming and getting snipped all the time. If she could practice how to behave when around dogs - first without any dogs present, then with a super calm dog at a distance - that might not be a bad idea.

I have to tell you, I was scared of the shoe salesman when I was wee. I mean, I would wail something serious when I saw him. And I remember it too. I feel bad for the man, because I can see his same face in my mind's eye and he was a nice man. But I can also feel the same desire to just wail. He was sort of pasty and just utterly alien to my mind.

Interestingly enough, there was also an incident once when my uncle came to pick me up and I couldn't tell if he was or wasn't my dad. I went quietly because I sorta decided my mind was playing tricks on me and that he was my dad - but he wasn't. My uncle mentioned it a few years ago and I was like, Oh! That wasn't my dad!

Amy

(website)

Veteran

As a parent, I would definitely seek professional help.

As a friend to that parent, I would suggest professional help IF asked for my advice.

As a host for playdates and other visits, I'd put my furbabies in another room. I'd want my guests, young and old to not feel scared in my home. I'd probably feel bad for the animals, but would try to keep in mind, that they're also probably better off not being around a person who's so obviously upset.

rae

(website)

Veteran

If she was scared enough, she may not even remember what happened!

I was bitten on the face by a playmate when I was about 3 years old - the kid sank her teeth in and would not let go until her mother *left work* and came to get her! I don't remember any of it, but I was terrified of all people for years and years. My mom told me about it when I was much older.

Now, I know from experience that ignoring it is not going to help. My dad used to snap that "they'er not going to bite" when I hid from strangers, and that just made things worse, as subconsciously I then felt I couldn't trust my dad.

If therapy is not an option, then I think an active approach is still necessary. Maybe some Lassie episodes, then observing animals from very far off, then puppies in a crate, and so on. Keep her talking, and if she loses it, ask her how bad it is (things I've read, sometimes therapists use a scale of 1-10, 10 being "I think I'm gonna die"). I know this is not the most professional example, but have you ever watched "Hoarders"? They always have the fearful person stay in the fearful state for a time, so they can see that their fears are not realized.

Isis

Veteran

AG-- We have had friends who have kids who are terrified of our very gentle dog or are allergic to our cat. I always just put the dog and cat in a bedroom or behind a door on the other side of the house. It's only for a couple hrs and my dog and cat are OK with that.....I figure it's not my job to desensitize another's child.....

Kim

Veteran

A little professional help would go a *loooong* way to helping this girl live a normal life. I had an irrational fear of flying (didin't do it for 25 years, YES YEARS.) Without doing anything about it it NEVER got better, in fact it only got WORSE, because my imagination is vivid and I can dream up some pretty wild scenerios involving me and airplanes! LOL

Until I DECIDED to take the bull by the horns and actively do something about it nothing got better on it's own. In her case it probably won't just "go away" without a little "help" and her parents obviously don't know how to help her (quite understandably.)

It's simply a little trick the brain is pulling on her, telling her that all animals are terrifying and deadly and need to be avoided at all costs (as would anything deadly.) For some reason, (real or perceived) her brain has decided to pin this anxiety on animals. That's actually good news because they are concrete things and this fear can be addressed with cognitive therapy. Imagine if her anxiety had been pinned on something else, like the color blue, instead! LOL (Don't laugh, that's how irrational my fear was, and hers is.)

The good news, it can be fixed. The bad news, not by you with all the coaxing in the world for her to like Kona. (Poor Kona!)

jayne

Veteran

I agree with RAE and Isis, and may about to be rude, but as a host, even of a neighbor, you would be very careful not to serve egg to an allergic person, so as a host, I assume that the dog has to go in another room, or the kid cannot come over.

Let the parents fix the problem if they want to, and don't take the chance your dog/cats inadvertently aggravates the problem. I was 'shocked' recently when I had a party and a young man, allergic to cats, expected me to stock my house with 'cat allergy' medicine. His reaction was so severe he was out of work for 3-4 days after. It is an inconvenience to me, but a disaster for him, so I have decided to take his advice. My pets are second to people. I know we love them like children but in the end, I try to be sensible about them.

Vicki

(website)

Veteran

I like Rae's advice and I had a frightening childhood experience where my sister and I went next door to play with some friends and their Boxer crashed through a side frosted window and ran at us as we raced away screaming in terror. We found out later, that another neighbor child had been teasing the dog through the frosted glass and when we came up, it was the wrong place at the wrong time, and the dog broke through the glass. Before that, we used to actually rest on and play with a huge Bull Mastiff, named Cindy, who was a lovable dog to our neighbors on the other side of us.

To this day, I am still very afraid of any dog, especially when I walk and see dogs unleashed. I guess I don't like it when they run toward me, because I don't know what they're going to do! I think they are cute and sweet and I will pet them when their owner says it's okay. But, seeing an unleashed dog, particularly large ones or those that have been trained for police work or that look menacing (yes, I'm talking about pit bulls, because they truly freak me out), I get queasy, freeze and weak to my stomach.

I am inherently a cat person and yet, when I see small, fluffy dogs, I seem to be all right. I think it's more the size and the "assumed" temperament of dogs. As Rae and the others have said, a gradual, slow desensitization process would help the child. My parents once visited a home where a pair of Doberman Pinschers had a history of biting and roughing up delivery people, but the owners adored them. They watched over them, but they believed that if you didn't like their dogs, then you could leave and they weren't about to put them in another room. I think it would have been better had they put the dogs in a separate room for those visitors who weren't comfortable around dogs. But, it's a really sensitive topic, because we all love our pet family members.

I have a friend who is highly allergic to cats (her eyes get red and itchy), but she loves cats. So, I usually make sure to clean off any surfaces where she'll be sitting and if and when she spends the night, when she's in town, I'll shut off her bedroom (even though the cats are not allowed in that room) to make sure there is no cat fur in the room.

cciele

Veteran

Aw, poor girl -- I hope this is something she grows out of. But I feel that it's something her parents need to deal with. As others have mentioned, the best a host can do is to be sensitive of guests' needs -- so that would mean putting the animals in another room while the guests are over. When I think of it, many of my friends automatically put their animals outside (or wherever) when they have guests over, phobic or not.

rachylou

Veteran

Um. If you're severely allergic, you really really need to carry your own epi pin. You can walk into a restaurant and sit down one table over from a pet owner and kabam. Severe allergies are too unusual for everyone else to be prepared. Schools don't even have automatic defibrillators...

Aziraphale

Veteran

I've read through the replies here again (there are quite a few more since I replied this morning!) and I feel I have a few more things to add.

Una, in your situation specifically, if this friend is a good friend, and it sounds like she is, you can probably discuss with her what strategy she would feel comfortable with. If the two of you want to keep getting together at your house, something needs to be done to address the situation, because I don't think it's fair to lock up your sweet, well-behaved dog, and in the long run doing so will not do the phobic child any favours. Claudia is right; animal-phobic kids become animal targets, and besides that, if this child cannot be taught to tolerate animals, how many friends' houses will be off-limits to her? Hopefully her mother recognizes what a big deal this is. How many people do you know with at least one dog or cat?

I'm not saying that kids must tolerate a badly behaved dog leaping all over the place and knocking them over. This is understandably upsetting, and the dog owner needs to train their dog not to do that! But children do need to learn to be in the presence of a dog without screaming hysterically. It's an incredibly inconvenient phobia that needs to be addressed. Your fear of honeycombs, however out-of-left-field it may be, isn't going to upset your life or anyone else's much. Domestic animal phobias do.

In our house, locking up the dog is not an option for the simple reason that she barks and howls and disturbs the whole neighbourhood if you put her outside (or in a separate room) by herself! We have tried all kinds of things, even hired a dog trainer, and we can't get her to stop doing that. She's otherwise quiet and well behaved -- in fact she mostly just sits around, being quite old. So we don't lock her up. Nervous kids have to get over it, or not come over. Luckily we've only ever had two such kids.

And Jayne: I respectfully disagree with you. That guy who the severe cat allergy who was annoyed that you did not stock antihistamines....WHAAAAT? He's a grown up and needs to take responsibility for his own health. If his allergy is serious enough that he had to miss several days of work, it's serious enough that he should carry around his own medication (and possibly an epi pen). I too am very allergic to cats, so if I'm going to a home that has cats (I always ask before going), I take my own damn antihistamines. Sheesh.

lyn*

(website)

Veteran

Late to convo - but I read that about the tiny holes. I have the same fear. I have shivers just thinking about it.

Anonymous

I have never considered myself to have an irrational fear of animals, but this post is giving me heart palpitations, seriously!

I was raised in a quiet home with no animals. I had a cat for a while, but my mother took it back to the pound because I wasn't being responsible enough with it (I as in the fourth grade). *trauma*

I was bitten my a dog on the beach as young child, but I don't remember that much about it.

Try to imagine not knowing ANYTHING about dogs and their behavior (this is likely the mindset of your friend's child). It always seemed like such a vain promise when I would visit a home with a large, barking dog and the owner would assure me, "Oh, he won't hurt you!" all the while grabbing at his collar as the dog choked and scratched to get to me, salivating at the thought of how I would taste!

Many times dogs jump up on me, scratching me with their claws while their master says benignly, "Down, down." but not doing anything to *make* the dog get off me. I have had my clothes snagged and soiled and the owners just laugh it off. I try to be a good sport about it, but it does raise my blood pressure! Even though I've watched a bit of the Dog Whisperer when we briefly had that channel I cannot understand what a dog's intentions are when he lunges at me. He is not smiling and cannot talk, after all, so are my fears irrational? I try to be calm and not care if he eats me for breakfast, because I can't show fear after all, right? They can't be allowed to smell my nervous perspiration or it will be all. over.

Last summer I was riding my bike at dusk when out of nowhere, a pitbull came charging at my ankles. His owner was walking him off leash and called to him (but they never listen!). I decided to just stop my bike and hand him the salt and pepper. Now I know that pitbulls are no more vicious than other breeds, unless they are trained to be that way. Even though I was secretly scared witless (and that other word that rhymes with witless, TYVM), I stopped and got down to his level and offered an open hand to sniff. I figured he would make me wreck if I didn't stop. I've blanked out most of the memory, but it must have turned out okay because I'm still alive to tell the story, lol!

I'm always mortified when I go to someone's house and their dog sniffs my crotch or humps my leg. Really? Does this mean I have an irrational fear of dogs? I'm sure getting a dog would cure all of this, but I really don't want one, any more than some people don't want children. I really don't hate them. I find them (especially puppies) extremely cute and cuddly. Some people I know crate their dogs when the doorbell rings. This might not be fair to the dog, but I feel very respected when I visit these homes. I enjoy meeting gentle dogs and petting them, and I can see why they are such good companions.

Wow, sorry for the rant. Perhaps I need counselling, too! Anyway, maybe your friend's child has had some experience that the parents don't know about? I just wanted to give you a different perspective.

Aziraphale

Veteran

Oh Claire, I'm sorry...now I feel bad for being so strident! Of course I do sympathize with people who are nervous around animals (and some dogs and cats DO bite), and an off-leash dog that jumps all over strangers is in dire need of some serious training. That's never acceptable! Owners need to take responsibility. (Very few dogs come reliably when called because it takes very careful and consistent training to accomplish that skill. It doesn't take a dog very long to figure out that it's a lot faster than you. But if you're letting it off leash, it MUST come when called). And dog lover though I am, I just cringe when you visit someone's house and their huge, hairy, drooling golden retriever knocks you over in its joyful attempt to welcome you into its home. Again, owners need to invest some time and energy into training.

But being nervous around wild, loud, out-of-control dogs is one thing; being irrationally afraid of a polite dog that is NOT jumping or barking is something else.

catgirl

Veteran

Claire, I totally understand how you feel, especially about out-of-control dogs. I have pepper-sprayed charging dogs on the trail to protect myself, my kid, AND my dog. Being afraid of a leaping, barking, growling or charging dog is absolutely rational. But Kona is the timidest, gentlest dog ever. This is what makes it a phobia - it's an *irrational* fear. And I think phobias have to be dealt with differently than fears, as you can't just explain them away with logic.

This is a good friend, and I consider this child a niece of sorts. Maybe talking to her directly about broader solutions would be the best thing, so I don't have to feel bad for both the girl and the dog every time they come up. My friend just called and asked if we could watch her daughter on Saturday - when I mentioned the dog issue, she said "Oh, don't worry about it, she'll be fine." I don't want to be the bad guy!

Anonymous

Aww thanks guys! I just looked at the calendar and realized I'm entering the "raging hormone" phase of the month, which can make me a little irrational, too!

Una, I feel so sorry for you! Your friend is putting you in a tough position. DH and I just talked about this on our walk. Even if the little girl has never had an actual negative experience with an animal, traditional "big bad wolf" nursery stories (complete with scary pictures) might have already done the damage. Plus who knows what she's seen accidentally on TV or online?

It would be asking a LOT to have you watch her for the weekend, as you'll essentially have to be her therapist or you'll have to take Kona to a kennel. That's like someone dropping off their 2 year old and asking you to potty train them. Above your pay grade, I'd say!

jayne

Veteran

he he loving this thread! you gals are so insightful and wise and have differing opinions which I LOVE!!!

Kyle

Veteran

Very tough call. I think you have been very accommodating. I was faced with a similar situation some years ago. I realize that this sounds insensitive, but it was my sense at the time that the freaking out over the dog was a way to get attention, and the parents were reinforcing the behavior, big time. Every time she cried or threw a fit, about anything (not just the dog) mom and dad came running and all focus was on her. So our gentle, elderly dog spent several days banished to the garage, in deference to my houseguests, and the 6-year old called the shots about virtually everything. Interestingly, the very well behaved older boy received very little attention from mom and dad.

The dog is part of your family and is clearly not a threat. If I were the parent I would give the child a choice. 1. Stay home with a babysitter when others go to your house. 2. Be part of the visit without throwing a fit about the dog. No once is forcing her to do something that causes her distress, and no one is asking you to disrupt your home and routine to accommodate her. Visiting and having a melt down or banishing the dog would not be an acceptable option.

Gaylene

Veteran

I'm just trying to imagine how a dog looks from the viewpoint of a 6 year-old child. Large head, big teeth, hairy face-- and all at eye level. Add in a dash of phobia and no wonder the child starts screaming. And I have a hard time seeing how forcing someone in that state into closer proximity with the dog, regardless of how gentle the animal was, would help overcome that fear.

While fears can be irrational, the emotions are real. Letting her know that you understand dogs frighten her and that no one will force her to get close to the dog might help her cope with her emotions when she visits. Point out that your house is Kona's home and ask her how she can visit Kona's home without getting scared. And maybe the best you can hope for is an uneasy truce between your beloved pet and your almost "niece". Some people never overcome their phobias about mice or snakes or spiders or dogs, but that doesn't mean that they can't eventually figure out how to co-exist with the creatures.

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