How are our opinions and "poison eyes" formed? - YouLookFab Forum

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How are our opinions and "poison eyes" formed?

Anonymous

I'm often out-of-sync now with what is liked or understood to be "so 2018" here on the forum, and never more so than recently, with the proliferation of high-rises, full tucks, wide leg crops, and certain colour/pattern mixes.

It got me wondering how our eyes and opinions are in/formed when looking at pictures of clothing ,and what makes one person's thoughts so different from another's.

Exposure to images, store displays, etc in big-city markets where the best retailers are using their skills to push the boundaries? Individual understanding of art , colour and proportion ?

Or is it also due to the baggage we each carry from our pasts, our own perceptions of what we would look like in a certain look that's stopping us from understanding/seeing how good it can look on someone else? Comments made to us in the past that has forever "scarred" us from accepting a look? What is it?

Not to make this all about me, because I'm really interested in what you all think of this.....but right now, I've never felt more out of it . I used to trust my eye implicitly and felt I carried an educated and experienced eye and brain for fashion and all that it entails, but for some reason , I'm not feeling a lot of it right now. I vow to be extremely careful in expressing my opinions going forward because I'm starting to question them...which no doubt will make a few of you sigh in relief

Your thoughts about what makes us like or understand a look , or the reverse ....?

p.s. I don't really mean to use the term "poison eye" because it's too strong a term for what I'm talking about here . I used it for brevity in the title

General

64 replies

Latest reply was from rachylou

delurked

Veteran

Joining you in being out of step with what’s in and my personal preferences. Glad others are finding what they like though, and trying to keep an open mind. My eye does usually adjust to new looks, but I’m not in love with this seasons offerings. Makes it easier to pass when I don’t need something. My past and what works on me definitely does play a role. Sometimes there are just things we don’t want to repeat, or things that look best on certain body shapes. I guess I’ll look at it as the new iteration is always a bit different, and eventually I may like something I don’t currently. Or not, since there’s always the next thing coming along.

ETA - I can appreciate something on someone else without wanting it for myself, especially if it brings them happiness.

LaPed

Veteran

For me, those "personal poison eyes" (because there's very little I dislike universally) are rooted in a combination of figure-flattery and gender-presentation concerns.

I very rarely do looks that surrender my waist, hit at low-hip or mid-calf, or involve low-vamp shoes. So as much as I love the vintage jeans trend, I won't be pairing them with oversized blazers and pumps, the way I'm seeing them styled on Instagram and elsewhere. It would be within my wheelhouse style-wise, and I love the look on others, but I wouldn't feel as good in it as when I wear those same jeans with, say, a tailored blazer and oxfords.

I've heard you express discomfort with looking too tomboyish in certain outfits and for me it's always been the opposite. I balk at ruffles, flounces, most florals and lace and (again) low vamp shoes. I'm not hesitant about including femme elements -- a mary-jane, something sparkly or pink, a floaty skirt -- but my instinct is always to juxtapose it with something tougher or sportier. I know from numerous theatre productions that I can wear a lacy tea dress as well as anyone, but only as a character, not as myself!

I don't think these preferences have changed much at all over my lifetime (except that as a kid I absolutely refused to wear pink). I'm pretty set in my own ways when it comes to getting dressed, despite having a very open mind and enjoying an enormous array of looks on others. I tend to adhere to the "everything looks good on someone, nothing looks good on everyone" philosophy.

nemosmom

Veteran

*Raises hand* I don't have an answer to your question, but I do often share you in "not feeling any of it". I suspect like delurked, my past and what have worked on me play a big part in what I am drawn to. I love a lot of this season's looks because they are a throwback to what I have successfully worn before (fully tucked, high rise, bootcuts, brown!!!).

But, my past flops may be different than another's flops, so naturally what works for me may not work for them. I can give my opinion on whether I think something looks cohesive or flattering on YOU, even though it isn't something that I would wear. Certain colors and patterns can look AMAZING on others, and certain silhouettes (like flared crops or pencil skirts) - I feel absolutely ridiculous wearing them, but if YOU feel confident and happy in them, GO FOR IT!

Angie

(website)

Fashion Stylist

Lisa p, our perceptions and preferences are formed by ALL the things you mention PLUS a lot of emotion. It's much like the biggest psychological question of all time: Nature vs. Nurture. How much of our personality is innate or shaped by the environment around us? We can debate this till the cows come home.

There is usually an adjustment period to new looks, silhouettes and proportions - but not when you liked them all along. That frame of mind is 100% personal and subjective. Nothing logical about it. In my experience, many people come to liking the new trends for the next 10 to 15 years. Skinnies are the best example. They were not well received by the public about 13 years ago - and fashion mags and experts said don't buy the one season fad. Well don't they all have egg on their face! Skinnies are the most worn bottoms on the planet, and the classic lives on.

There is no harm in not liking a look or trend at all. There is lots I don't like for myself! (Especially when I wade through hundreds of fashion shows every season). The points are three-fold, which keep my mind very open (essential for my line of work):

I need to see where the trends are going and watch how they filter through to retail and how that's different globally.

It's important to appreciate how someone else loves and looks fab in a vibe that you wouldn't wear yourself. I see this a lot when I travel, and work with clients. There is very, very rarely a client who wears a look I would wear head to toe myself. And they don't want to dress head to toe like me either! But I love their look on and for them.

Although we can't help our poison eyes, try to keep them to a minimum because fashion is extremely subjective and personal.

It's actually hard NOT to look current these days. Fashion and style are the biggest melting pot of all. I mean, we're living in a fashion era where classics become trendy and you can wear sneakers with everything! And style is as individual as ever. It's like living in London. No matter who you are and what you like or dislike, you will find your place in it all and just be.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

What I don't care for on myself is entirely different from how I feel about a look on others. Example: Rightly or wrongly, I don't like myself in skirted leggings (AKA butt vests). But I think you and Alaskagirl look amazing in them! So amazing that I was tempted to give them a try. FAIL.

So what? That's the fun of fashion. Nothing to do but laugh, let the item go to someone who loves it more, and move on.

Are there items or trends I wouldn't even bother to try? For sure! And increasingly so, as I become more confident in my own preferences. Usually I know it's a no if I have tried similar items or combinations and felt "off" in the past. But not always. Another example: Twenty years ago, I'd have had a very low tolerance for irregular outfit juxtaposition, pattern mixing, and sneakers with dressier outfits. But not any more. My tastes have changed or adapted with the times and trends. Again -- that's the fun of fashion!

Like LaPed, my preferences for myself are formed by some combination of perceived figure flattery, history with an item or combination, and comfort level with some types of detail, combined with a love (or dislike) for certain fashion eras and their aesthetic. For instance, I adore 60s mod and anything that evokes that typically gets a nod from me. I love late 40s new-look glamour and also the double breasted suits of the era. I like the slinky bias cut gowns of the 30s. I like the drop waists of the 20s. I feel nostalgia for the 70s and 80s. The 50s and 90s leave me pretty much cold; I wasn't around for the 50s and the fashions seem very restrictive to women, and in the 90s I was too busy figuring out my work life and family life then and paying off debts to be focussed on fashion.

I grew up tucking tops so I'm used to it. (In fact, it took me some time to get used to the untucked top look! When people first started wearing it, I thought it was "messy.")

I will gladly reveal or surrender the waist, but I tend not to like "long on top" looks for myself because I think they mess up my personal proportions. (My legs are on the short side.) That said, I love the look on long-legged ITs!! Or petites whose legs are relatively longer than torso. I sometimes wish I could wear it happily. But I can't, so I don't.

My own personal poison eye is mainly for poor fit. I dislike clothing that is too tight, unintentionally oversized, etc. And I don't care for outfits that seem to hide or detract from the personality and flair of the individual who is wearing them. That second quality is difficult to explain and maybe you have to know a person to know if it is truly happening -- it's not just about colour flattery or figure flattery on the person -- but that is part of it. Generally, if someone looks ill at ease in their clothes, that awakens my poison eye. Whereas if someone looks happy and "in sync" in their clothing, I can appreciate their look even if it is 50s pin-up or 90s goth.

Jules

Veteran

Dunno how but once I realize I have a ‘poison eye’ for a certain style I try really hard not to comment on individual’s posts about these. Not that I would generally post a super negative opinion, but if they are asking for an opinion on a choice of white footwear or something with a covered heel (a look I have realized I dislike across various styles), I refrain from commenting because I just don’t like those things so it’d be like giving my opinion on any other thing I have no interest in - unwanted and unnecessary. Commenting on a blog post is different, I’m talking about reacting to individual choices.
As for getting used to look, I definitely remember the majority of women I knew including myself, aged only late twenties and prekids for most of us, saying the new skinny jeans would never look good on the majority of women. Well it seems our eye adjusted, along with perhaps some cultural beauty ideals around lower body curves. At some point the person stubbornly insisting that x dated look is the most flattering is just behind the times even if objectively ‘correct’.

Anonymous

I’m thinking more about finding one’s opinion different from most /others . I see this happen on threads where I don’t see a look as flattering or working well , whereas others do . *That’s* was confuses me.

Sal

Veteran

I have had this happen Lisa and depending on the post I may just not opt in. If it is a k/r post I am more likely to chime in - but if someone is posting their new favourite look I am more cautious. We are a positive kind lot here which is rare and wonderful!

i sometimes cringe at my own WIW as I see all my faults - both in terms of the outfit, how I look and sometimes my messy house! But the benefits outweigh my own issues. Sometimes I wonder if people are being too kind about an outfit - that is my cynical side!!

I am finding the fashions more me this year than the past few - tailoring, waist definition, midi length and volume on the legs are quite natural fits for me.

There are looks I love on me, looks I love on others but could not carry off myself, and a few looks that I am not drawn to much at all. But my eye and mind does change too.....

I think being in the opposite season to most on the forum makes it easier in many ways. I have copycatted once or twice but it is hard to do so.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

So...on my jacket thread yesterday, people's opinions varied. Some people liked the jacket with white and denim. Others liked it better with plums. Others enjoyed it with red, still others thought it was fun pattern mixed (and preferred different pattern mixes.)

Some found it flattering one way -- and not another. Some people probably hated the jacket on me, full stop, and didn't even bother to comment! It's all good.

Some people hate blazers, period, because they think they read "corporate" no matter how they are styled. Or "manly." Or something else. Those people have a poison eye for blazers. To you (and to me) such an idea is almost sacrilege -- we love blazers and can't imagine how anyone could find them inherently unflattering or unfashionable. But there you go, courses for horses, as Angie says.

My own near-poison eye for furlebows made it sometimes hard for me to be objective about frilly exuberant sleeves. But one thing I love about YLF is that quite often my eye becomes acclimated to a look by seeing it on someone who wears it really well. It might even sway me in favour of that look and change my mind completely! (That happened with pattern mixing.)

It just goes to show that people's tastes and feelings about what flatters really are individual! I really like hearing the varied opinions. (So please don't stop expressing your own!) Sometimes my own opinion matches the forum's and/or Angie's, and sometimes it doesn't. That's okay. Isn't that what it's all about? Refining our personal fashion preferences while also expanding our ideas about beauty?

Note that Angie will often express a preference for a look on a forum member based on what she knows of that member and her style vs. some putative "objective" standard. In other words (in my observation, at least) she often comments positively when she sees a person stretching her style in directions that seem true to her. So, for a "trendy modern classic" type like me or Mirjana -- trying a new trend that could work well with some tweaking, or -- for a member like Gryffin and possibly you as well -- choosing an item that works perfectly with her already very refined aesthetic preferences. If you didn't know the person or her style you might at first wonder why Angie (or forum members) were commenting so positively. But seeing it in context really helps.

Angie

(website)

Fashion Stylist

Suz and La Ped on two more key points:

Figure Flattering Priorities are personal. What is a figure flattering priority to you is not to another. And the landscape of what is thought of as traditionally flattering is becoming as clear as mud these days.

Context is important

Suz, thank you for your last comment. It's a lot more specific and I appreciate the time you took to write it.

Gaylene

Veteran

Everything that Suz, Angie, and Jules said. The only area where I mildly differ is with negativity associated with a “poisoned eye”.

If my job, or desire, involves helping others discover their own ideas, opinions, likes, and dislikes, then working on my “poisoned eye” is one way of avoiding the trap of a closed mind.

On the other hand, that same “poisoned eye” can be my be my salvation when I’m faced with self-styled “experts” suggesting I need to “adjust” or risk being left behind. It can be tricky to discern the point at which “expertise” has been subsumed by marketing/media interests and personal values. Thinking “the emperor has no clothes” instead of adjusting and adapting can be the starting point of forming a personal style which reflects MY ideas about how I want to present myself to the world.

Anonymous

Well, my opinions are often out of touch with the majority on YLF.
For ex., my opinion on kkards’ k/r thread on bottoms is that the black coated skinnies looked far-and-away the best on her. KKards also has some lower rise skinnies that look amazing on her, but she called them “dated” though did admit they still looked good. To me, both looked classic and amazing.

I often have a different opinion from angie, especially about trends, but I’m still aware of the trends, so i don’t feel out of touch. I find it hard to participate in most trends, even though I want to, because I am just not that trendy. I want OTHER people to wear trends though, as that makes YLF more fun!

I have a lot of poison eye but it is not related to trends at all.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

Smittie, that's really interesting... I'd love to hear more! Are your poison eyes related to history or what?

I forgot to mention my own well-known poison eye for "seasonal confusion" although I do try to keep in mind that not all parts of the world experience seasons like my own!

Gaylene, I'm not sure "poison eye" is the term you want. Poison eye seems to indicate some judgement of what others are wearing. But you could know that something is wrong for you without feeling poison eye toward it at all. That's precisely how we refine our personal style.

I can also have "sugar eye" for certain looks yet avoid wearing them myself because they don't work for me either practically or according to my own personal figure flattery priorities. I love the look of big oversized sweaters atop slim leather leggings, for instance. But don't wear that look despite my own sugar eye. Then again, I also have a sugar eye for Chelsea boots and I have rarely met one I did not love or long to wear...

Angie, that's a really good point about our figure flattery priorities differing -- just as our feelings of love or nostalgia for specific fashion eras differ. Some people want to emphasize their waists, while others (with similar waist measurements) might prefer hiding it. Some are self-conscious about their feet and won't wear shoes of a certain style while others (whose feet are the same size) have never given it a second thought.

In terms of aesthetics -- we're told that in the past people tried to follow the rule of thirds with regard to proportion, and with respect to fit they tried to emphasize the female form. But even if we buy that -- each era had its own figure flattering priorities. The bust, the waist, the ankle. And these days we can pick and choose, which is really fun.

LaPed

Veteran

I do think nostalgia and the predominant styles during critical points in one's development influence one's eye for fashion. I'd wager nany if not most people absorb "the rules" most eagerly as teens/young adults, so looking at what was "in" when one was going through adolescence is usually informative. For me, in the late 90s/early 00s, it was fitted/cropped tops with wide legs and flares, plus chunky shoes. At least, that's what I've hung onto. Perfectly happy to leave behind the super-low rises and tiny sunglasses.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

And it might be generational in another way, too. My grandmother was a flapper (seriously!) -- and I love the 20s. My mother was young in the 40s (and felt romantically nostalgic herself about the 30s fashions) -- I like the 30s and 40s.

I was a kid in the 60s/70s and enjoyed the fashions then -- the 60s in a kind of nostalgic way (since I was too young to really experience wearing those clothes) and the 70s because, well, 70s.

And the 80s were formative as my late teens/young adult years.

After that, it gets foggy until YLF.

rachylou

Veteran

My strongest ‘poison eye’ is totally rooted in tribalism. My parents, my town are full of fear and loathing for the gated communities in the suburbs around us. I have to stamp down hard on it because 1) I went to high school out there and 2) I kinda like it. Still, it defines bad taste and horror to me in my inner soul. Pink lip gloss, white cotton sweaters, big empty houses with a horse statue straight from the advertising pages of Architectural Digest, and carpeted garages.

And it’s funny - I once overheard some people visiting here from there. They left their Gap caps in the car so they wouldn’t get beat up. It’s like that. I definitely don’t drive after dark there. I’d get stopped by the cops. I don’t drive a Range Rover...

Jules

Veteran

For me ‘poison eye’ is definitely not a value judgement. It’s just some style element or look I’ve realized I have an irrational dislike of, can’t appreciate it at all on anyone, can’t really tell you why, I just never like it. For that reason I refrain from commenting because I realize my biased opinion is colouring my reaction. So for whatever reason I dislike any kind of covered heel, it looks ‘wrong’ to me and I will react negatively to that shoe - even before I understood the concept or knew the word for that type of heel, I just disliked them but wouldn’t have been able to tell you why. If someone asks the forum to choose between 3 pairs of boots and 1 has a covered heel, I probably can’t give an unbiased opinion that’s relevant to a person who likes covered heels, and once I recognize this I try to refrain.

Jane

Veteran

I do understand what you mean - I find Cos a store where I can almost never quite understand how something is going to look or feel on me - it is like I am constantly looking at new styles, shapes, cuts all of the time - it can all look 'off' to me, but then I start to try stuff on and I begin to understand it. Then it becomes less poison eye. Then I am almost cross with myself for having not tried something different before.

sometimes I think part of the problem is just not knowing where to start looking at the best of a new trend or style....kind of I need to get my eye tuned in, and then the trend makes sense and doesn't seem quite so alien and then I can start to shop for it...

delurked

Veteran

Lisa P - I sometimes have the same issue as your last comment. I may not find something as flattering in a pic as others do. In that case, I usually refrain from comment unless it’s a K/R or asking specifically for critical feedback. But if I see someone wearing it happily, I am usually a non comment and figure the reverse could be true of me. That if I feel good in something, even if it’s not technically the most flattering look, I’m ok with that. Sometimes it’s about trying a new style or enjoying fashion in a more lighthearted way.

Helena

Veteran

Well I have not much wisdom to share, but I can say for sure that I haven't the first bloody clue what's in style really. My surroundings are pretty yoga-pants-ish, the stores look like a hot mess to me for the most part, and I don't really consume much media that would help me along. Without Angie, I'd be out of the loop completely. So I feel your pain!

Joy

Veteran

I agree with Angie and others. I almost always eventually warm to any trend I thought I disliked. It seems like the challenge is to find your own version of it and that takes effort. One of the "joys" of being older is that every new trend looks familiar.something you have worn or seen. It lessens poison eye in that you know it is not for you but you have seen others wear it well.

Anonymous

As I mentioned earlier, poison eye was the wrong term to use. This really isn't about that. It's funny , Smittie , that you mention kkard's jeans thread, because that was the instigator for this thread. I don't really have a poison eye for anything . People can wear whatever they want, but if asked, I usually have an opinion. I don't provide one if I have no reaction to an outfit, but I certainly have thoughts as to what looks good , and like to think I can see beyond some "ideal/perfect" body type as the critical part of a look . As to what makes a good representation of a trend or current favoured look - that's where I get confused. Maybe I shouldn't be second-guessing my opinions after all?

I used to feel pretty on top of what was trending and how fashion was moving, but then again I read A LOT, shopped a lot, and travelled a lot. I'd have been the first one to be buying Western influenced boots and button front cropped jeans .Now - not so much. I shop far, far less than I used to, and don't travel much anymore. I used to have the time to read all of the fashion mags and blogs and knew every name of every designer, creative director and stylist. Again, not now. I'm lucky if I can get through a couple of magazines a month.

I'm wondering if it's learning how to accept being a bit of a square peg in a round hole here on the forum , or being more confident with my eye and accepting that not everyone likes everything . Anyways, thanks all for your thoughts here - really interesting reading !

Suz

(website)

Veteran

Jules, that's really interesting. I can see that, about irrational quirky dislikes not necessarily carrying a value judgement. Trying to think if I have any of those. Not sure I do.

rachylou

Veteran

I wanted to add, thinking about trend spotting and what represents a ‘good’ (accurate?) interpretation and what doesn’t... the difference between Here and There... the trends are really interpreted quite differently. Leopard in town v leopard in the ‘burbs... not the same at all... I personally think about that a lot when I give praise.

Brooklyn

Veteran

I think the culture here is very positive and kind. That’s a good thing of course (and refreshing since this is the internet) but it does make it harder to express a negative opinion even if it’s put super tactfully. I would only express a negative opinion on a thread if the poster seemed to be genuinely inviting comments eg a K/R. But even in that case, I often decide not to make a negative comment if it’s after a rush of positive comments. I have also noticed on a few threads that when I have said something mildly negative (like: I don’t think that’s your style, or I’m not sure about that colour on you) that people will pile on afterwards to disagree. Which then makes me think: I should have kept my big mouth shut! But I don’t think I’m necessarily alone in my view.
Also, there is a very dominant aesthetic here. But that’s not everyone’s aesthetic.

Anonymous

Brooklyn: YES. To everything you wrote.

UmmLila (Lisa)

Veteran

I pick up my fashion ideas from Instagram, magazines, web sites, blogs and so on. Not to be political, but there are so many topics in the world that I find depressing now, that I enjoy keeping up with arts and culture more, including fashion.

I agree that the aesthetics and favored trends of the forum are not the same as those in, say, Instagram world. And that's fine. We are different people than most Instagram influencers. It's why we have a separate forum, and I thank Angie and Greg very much for creating and offering this space to do so. And if we are going to discuss fashion, we should acknowledge that fashion is trend driven and changes over time. If people want to stay in the exact same look they liked best in, say 1995, with no updates, this might not be the place to get validation on that.

If we're going to discuss trends, styles, outfits, or respond to people's requests for feedback, the whole point is to constructively say why we don't like or relate to a specific trend, or to add an actual useful criticism of a particular look. Otherwise, it makes things quite dull.

Christina F.

Veteran

Many others have commenting beautifully on this topic above, so I won’t belabor what I have to say. I’d just add that I think it’s important to the community here to keep different opinions in the mix. That’s important to any community, really, so that it doesn’t become an echo chamber. The fact that people have different opinions here has helped me to evolve my own eye and style.

SarahD8

Veteran

Oh, Brooklyn, that is all VERY astute. I know that for myself, I am genuinely interested in improving or at least better understanding my style, and that requires an openness (even though it inevitably stings!) to constructive criticism. But, I also agree that there is a dominant aesthetic here and it isn’t mine. In the past I’ve participated in other style groups/forums and grown frustrated when it seemed that I got more praise the more closely I hewed to the dominant aesthetic, but those looks weren’t me!!! One of the reasons I like ylf is that I’ve not felt that pressure to conform. But, on the other hand, that positive culture maybe does make me miss out on the learning a bit. It’s a tough balance to strike.

Lisa, it occurs to me that your job, lifestyle, and relationship to fashion/style (both professionally and in terms of your own getting dressed) have recently changed, a LOT. Maybe this “out-of-sync” feeling you describe is part of all that stuff settling into a new shape for you.

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