AG, your friend sounds incredible!!! Also I've actually read one of her pictures books with my niece, The Girl in the Castle Inside the Museum and loved it. I didn't realise she was also a professor! Have now requested that short story anthology from the library.

Ohhh Jenanded Queen Boadecia is an awesome style icon!!! You need lots of blue.

And now I need to close YLF for awhile. So addictive! hehe

Hmmmmm.....I've read this thread about four times now and honestly my response is ...I HAVE NO IDEA!

I do think my shorter stature and apple curves work for my retro/vintage items. Somehow I think of women in the 50's as smaller - I have absolutely no clue why that is however.

But now that I seem to be shifting away from that and heading into a more modern, sleek kind of look, I'm not sure my stature works. I also have a visual love affair with Helmut Lang but his clothes aren't exactly suited to short plump women are they?

At the risk of sounding like a conceited twit, I like my body and I consider it perfect (for me, obviously). I tend to dress in what I think looks good and works with my shape. In magazines and movies, I look for models/actresses with bodies similar to mine, to get inspiration.

I think some people's issues stem from a disconnect not so much between their body and style, but rather between their body and the one they really want. True style is is first and foremost about self-acceptance. How else could one feel good in one's own skin?

Alexandra, wise words. While I think that's true to a degree, it is also true that at 5'1", I am never going to look imposingly tall and lean in my clothes, no matter how I style them!

Such an interesting discussion! I'm loving reading all of the comments - and it seems there are more questions being brought up, than there are answers!

I don't know how I had managed to miss all of E's WIW threads - but, I did! So, first thing I did was go back and look at her WIWs - and her explanations of her thought process (so fun to read!) And Una - I totally get what you say about E's style persona fitting so well with her physical characteristics. It just looks so natural - and perfect. But then E chimed in on this thread and said that her style does not really fit with her personality - which I think is very cool! I guess I'm one of those that loves to "keep 'em guessing."

So, are we talking about style persona fitting with our physical characteristics, or fitting with our personalities, or with our fanatasy life? (or, does it matter?)

Una - I definitely think that your physical characteristics fit with your UWP style persona. Dark, thick hair, IT body shape - I would think that any UWP would welcome having those physical characteristics. I mean, can you imagine E trying to pull off that style? - or Mo (with her long wavy hair - all of that gorgeous hair would just get in the way for a UWP!) Also, from what I know of your personality - I think your style persona is a good match. You look strong, powerful, smart - a no-nonsense kind of woman. So . . . what am I saying? I don't know - I'm just kind of rambling.

As for myself - I pretty much think that my style persona works well with my physical characteristics. However, one of my fantasies is that I am 6' tall and can dress like Tilda Sinton. Can you imagine me trying to pull that one off in my 5'5" body with my round features, fleshy face, large nose? Just would not work. Another fantasy is that I am the first female President of the U.S.. Hahahahahaha - that is sooooo funny in soooooo many ways! Wonder if I could pull off a pantsuit?

I do however, have a couple of fantasies that do work well for my style persona: 1) a rock n' roll singer - not just any - but the best rock n' roll singer, ever. 2) that I am a painter/writer/sculptor and live in a loft in NYC - and just immerse myself in "art" all day long. and 3) that I am an Olympic gold medal champion - in several different sports. (OMG, I cannot believe how narcissitic I am!) So . . . those 3 fantasies are incorporated into my style - quite easily I must say! And - I think they work well with my personality - I love being on a stage, I am extremely right-brained oriented, I love and participate in a lot of different sports, and if necessary, I can run a high-powered corporation, hire and fire people, develop and/read fiancial reports, and do all the tough stuff that comes with having "the buck stops here" job description!

Going to sign off for now - but thanks for a great thread topic!

It's definitely interesting to see how a person's style and their personality mesh, as well as the physical aspects, and how intentional the matching/not-matching is. Like Marley, I think it's cool that E's style doesn't reflect her personality -- or what others would assume her personality to be like, based on her whimsical, urchin look.

I identify with "rocker warrior" and I think my body type matches (although I wouldn't mind being a bit taller!). I have curves but I also have muscle. I think others see me the same way, given that I've heard comments that I'm not someone to be messed with, or that I'm a bad a** ;). And since I play rock music, that part is self explanatory.

My style preferences primarily reflect my personality, my likes and dislikes. So my style doesn't necessarily stem from my physical features, but my physical features mesh with my style preferences. Does that make sense?

Shannon, I think women must have been smaller in the '50s. Either that, or only the small ladies' clothes ever made it into the vintage shops! Ladies wore girdles true, but not corsets!

Harmony is the word that comes to mind when I think I how E's looks match her style. We see a perfect match of body structure and styling that is somehow magical as if a movie character came to life. I see this in your style as well, Una. I think your blue hair and rockin boots match your UWP persona and go well with your features. (I had no idea you were 5'1" I would have guessed you were 5'6' from your pictures!).

I think that E could pull off a vampy Kate Moss look as well if she wanted. I think some body features match better with some styles and that is why a certain actor my be selected to play a certain role in a movie. When it all comes together there is harmony.

Really interesting discussion. I could write a book on this but will try to keep it brief. I will also just talk about me & my body

The disconnect didn't come from hating my body it came from being told I had to wear certain clothes to look "good". That meant looking good to other people. Looking good usually meant following someones rules on harmony, correct colours & shapes for me. The only time my personality was mentioned was in some superficial way as a classic or creative or whatever. The emphasis in these systems is always on harmony. Why do we all have to be harmonious? Beethoven didn't sound harmonious to his audiences. I love both Picasso & Turner paintings. Can't we have both?

It took me a long time to realise I could please myself first, in my clothing choices, without actually hurting anyone else - sounds stupid when I write it but it's true. I'm in awe of you young women who have this sorted already I understand the need to fit in & be respected at work & in our social lives but I think that I tried to do that at the expense of who I was. Like E my personality is much stronger than my looks would suggest. This was even more pronounced when I was younger. I like to play with that too.

In my fantasy world I don't think about my clothes they are just there - a part of me. I can do everything I need to in them & feel great when I look in the mirror Oh & they are made by the love child of Balenciaga & Phoebe Philo.

I knew I wouldn't be able to stop This is part of what I was trying to get at:

"Do designers dictate hemlines?" the late style doyenne Diana Vreeland was once asked. "Only if you take dictation," she replied.

With that remark she exposed a rift the fashion world seldom flaunts. There is a vast gap between fashion and style. Fashion is about clothes and their relationship to the moment. Style is about you and your relationship to yourself. Fashion is in the clothes. Style is in the wearer. The distinction could not be more revealing.

Despite the proliferation of fashion, style has been out of style for decades. As the economy expanded, America embarked on a collective shopping spree. In place of style we have honored Merchandise. Clothes. Style, on the other hand, doesn't demand a credit card. It prospers on courage and creativity.

Style goes way beyond fashion; it is an individually distinctive way of putting ourselves together. It is a unique blend of spirit and substance—personal identity imposed on, and created through, the world of things. It is a way of capturing something vibrant, making a statement about ourselves in clothes. It is what people really want when they aspire to be fashionable (if they aren't just adorning themselves in status symbols).

The full article is here:

http://www.psychologytoday.com.....imperative

Wonderful thought provoking post--I will go back and read the earlier ones.

I am still occasionally surprised when I look in a mirror or see a photo and my former self-image doesn't appear. That woman is a cross between young Audrey Hepburn (never that skinny) and a youngish sister of mature Cheryl Tiegs. (I used to think that one of my sisters could be mistaken for Cheryl.)

Kind of a shock to see breast and belly and hips. What happened to my shoulders? What happened to that waist so small I had to take my belts to the cobbler to have them shortened? (Cue music to "Sunrise, Sunset.") My fantasy wears a modified 60s mod look crossed with the 70s Tiegs look of long legs, fitted jeans, white shirt and fitted blazer.

Then I remind myself to be thankful for what I have and to figure out how to make the best of it.

I'm having fun with the body I've got 'cause it's pretty much a product of my own making after 40 years of living an active lifestyle and being blessed with good health. Though I encounter some fit challenges like most everyone, I believe that I could manage to pull off elements of almost any style I would wish too, if I set my mind to it. And you can't discount the importance of good undergarments to some looks. I could even colour my hair and iron it flat every day if I aspired to that look. Heck, a little TLC with creams and makeup can change up facial features too, though a real dewy youthful look isn't in the cards for me anymore!

So, I'll just keep plugging away at combining sporty casual with classic chic while I aim for a high happiness factor with outfits from a carefully curated closet!

(And in my dreams I look like this....)

In fantasy land, I am a sexy spooky bombshell, with cartoonishly exaggerated curves. Like a gothy Jessica Rabbit, or Christina Hendricks if she got a makeover from Morticia Addams. Or maybe like Jennifer Tilley in Bride of Chucky. But the fact is, I'm not curvy. My cups do not runneth over - they're barely filling up that bra I got in the juniors department. My hips are only marginally wider than my waist, and my rear can barely hold up a pair of pants. So I make do with my column/triangle shape. I fake a waist, I wear tight jeans and tight skirts, and I generally resign myself to being a little bit more bad-ass than bordello.

Here's fantasy me.

In my head I am taller and much more androgynous than I actually am. But, over time, my internal image and the external have blended together more smoothly. I think getting a haircut helped (it can go a long way, but of course ultimately we have the hair we're born with). Currently I think my style comes through loud and clear, though I wasn't so sure that was true until I started posting to this forum.

I have a lot of radical queer female friends, including many who are transgender, identifying as female but born male. So, among those groups, gender and appearance and internal vs external image are huge important topics. It's really interesting to hear about how they navigate these questions. My last roommate identified as lesbian and butch, intentionally signifying the butchness with her haircut and clothing choices. My figure is definitely more boyish than her curves, but the actual shape is not the important thing at all. And no matter how I dress I won't exude butch the way she manages to, because somehow it comes from within.

What an intriguing thread. The first thing that struck me about E is how integrated her look is so I totally understand where you are coming from Una. And I think that is true style - where there seems to be an integration between the clothes and the wearer. That is why I have a hard time judging pieces and ensembles for other people. And while I have a pretty good grasp on what I like for myself, I am never quite sure until I try it on.

Anyway, most of my floating wishes are more on the line of improvements on me (better skin, flatter stomach, I could go on...) rather than major changes in height or coloring. Sometimes I stand next to a taller, blonder woman and feel like a stumpy hag, but not too often. This came with maturity and I am sure I was much harder on myself when I was younger. I am more about working with what I've got now and pleasing myself in the mirror. I consider recognizing why I like something on someone else AND understanding why I would not like it on me, a great style achievement.

Hope that ramble is sort of on topic!

This is an interesting thread. E, I hope you don't feel too on the spot! I too have loved your WIW's.

For me, I wouldn't say that my fashion personas are a working out of my fantasy life. I would instead say that they reflect real parts of who I am, parts of me that maybe need to develop more. Perhaps by wearing clothes that are more body-con and feminine, I give myself permission to be more feminine; perhaps by wearing boho-style clothes, I give myself permission to be more carefree and not so perfectionistic. I have always seen my clothes as an extension of who I am inside, not simply a vehicle to make me look good.

Interestingly, when I saw E's WIWs, I thought to myself that the type of clothes she was wearing would look good on me too. I am kind of a pixie type of person, a bit like an elf :^). But urchin/fairy tale is not ME. For me, dressing up as urchin/fairy tale would be utilitarian--wearing clothes that look good on me simply for practical reasons. But I am not just a body to dress. I am a person with various facets to my personality. And I am finding that wearing different styles of clothes is for me like therapy, allowing myself to "expand" and enrich my personality.

Fascinating thread! I could write a whole rambling book on this, but will try to be brief-ish.

I feel like, on one level, my looks are so specifically soft and curvy and petite that they've short-circuited my fantasy life. There's a huge range of aesthetics (anything strict and architectural, sporty, preppy/polished, androgynous, rock'n'roll, UWP) that seem to conflict so much with my looks and body type that I have a hard time even engaging with them as potential influences for my style. Which sounds kind of sad when I write it out, doesn't it?

My actual fantasy styles seem to be things that fit with my height, features, and coloring, but work best to me with a more straight-up-and-down body, or at least a slightly thinner one, than I have. Quirky vintage gamine. Effortlessly stylish urbanite who wears lots of black and always has awesome shoes. Pretty much anything Euro-chic. There may also be an Italian olive oil heiress in there, along with a WWII-era world-traveling writer who's possibly a spy, but those are a little less directly on point.

Back in the real world, I feel like trying to dress for my looks/shape while picking stuff that fits my taste and feels like "me" winds up putting me into boho territory. Which I'm ambivalent about. It's sort of growing on me, but I'm not sure it's necessarily what I would have chosen in a perfect world.

This is a such an interesting thread! For me, I think the way I look blends pretty well with my style persona, (for now lets say "urban eclectic") I love mixtures of tough and sensual fabrics, intense color and dark hues. I have a lot of interests, and I think my style has a bit of that eclectic influence as well.

I am naturally drawn to clothing and styles that are cut to fit my curvy body, although I do very much appreciate the beauty in bodies that are very different from mine, for instance the angularity of Iman's physique or dramatic coloring of Catherine Zeta Jones. Sometimes I look at more graphic, angular, avant-garde clothing and wish it were cut to fit curves, instead of a more linear body, just to I could experience the pleasure of wearing such pieces! But there are enough other styles of clothing, focusing more on draping,(for instance) that are equally dramatic and designed for curves, I never really want to have a different type of body.

I think I do tend to look younger than I am, and I feel that sometimes my light coloring, blond hair and facial features can project a more carefree persona, that is less serious that I generally am. I imagine I am a cross between Bridget Bardot and Xena, with the artistic intensity of Frida Khalo. My favorite halloween costumes over the years have been a Viking Warrior and Cleopatra, certainly styles that blend my interests!

In my fantasy life physically I imagine I am much taller, say 5'9", (instead of my 5'5") with very long legs, strong muscles and a defined waist! Since I can work on the waist & muscles, I feel pretty good about having my fantasy life as an inspiration! Oh, and I imagine I can play the guitar like a rock star!

What a fascinating thread!
After 5+ years on YLF I haven't worked out my fashion persona yet!! I guess that is YLF 201 and I 'm still stuck in 101 - getting the colours, styles, approriateness and fashionability happening.

I can saythat when 50's style dresses were in in the 80's by friends laughed at me (cruelly, yet on target) for thinking that someone like small busted me could fill out the sweet heart necklines I liked back then.

I feel like my figure is more in tune with the 30s and 40's fashions that I also admire. But I don't really know howmuch this admiration actually affects my day to day dressing!

I have realized in my style journey that I can never ever be Angie/Suz (modern classic) or E (cutesy and vintagey) or Deborah (arty and drapey) or MaryK (colorful and bold) though I adore their styles.

But I can see Rae, Una, Ceit in bits and pieces in my outfits! Definitely it has to do with the similarities I have with my style icons both looks wise and the outfit character wise (edgy, RATE and tough). My real look says nothing of that! It at best can be defined as girly (long hair) and boring (no make up)!

In my head I want to look like a pixie haired hip girl! My style icons IRL are Pink and Ellen Degenres! Two opposite sides of the coin! DH has told me I could never ever carry off a pixie ....... I really wish I could. And I am not giving up without giving it a try

Oh I feel like I need to clarify! My style *does* match my personality, just not every aspect of it. Because personality is far more complicated than clothes. But I do love fairy tales and old books and the woods and the ocean and feeling as if I could blend in to one of those things makes me happy. And I am quirky and detail-oriented and playful. My clothes feel like *me*. It's just that there's another aspect of my personality that's much more sarcastic and smart, kind of like a His Girl Friday, that simply doesn't chime with my face, unless I added a decent amount of makeup and maybe dyed my hair darker.

I do love my body & face now & wouldn't really trade them, with all of their quirks. Just that it took time to get there, especially from when I was in high school! By the time I was 21/22, I had good body self esteem, but it was a bit different from now, when I feel like my brain and personality and body are all integrated, rather than imagining my body as a separate entity. Does that make sense? I do think my figure would have allowed me to go in other style directions if I wanted to, although wrap dresses are never going to be the ultimate in flattery on me, but since I was leaning towards a kind of old-fashioned, playful feel to begin with, I found through trial and error the types of clothes that both flattered me and felt true to this style.

Gigi, I don't feel too on the spot because everyone in the forum is so nice! I just wish I was better at conveying my thoughts clearly, but I suspect it's the thoughts themselves that are a bit murky! Like you, I find that the clothes I wear affect how I feel/convey myself.

E, I'm really glad you chimed in because I was beginning to think I had misunderstood. I knew your clothes felt like an extension of who you are (as well as your body type and facial features.) Well, not that I know you, of course. But I don't think a look that harmonious is possible unless it fits the wearer's personality.

And Caro - by harmony -- I'm talking about what works on the wearer -- not smoothing everything out, but creating something cohesive, integrated, whole. So...with my angles, certain kinds of draping just won't work and I won't feel right. I might admire it, long to wear it (and I do...) but I need to find different elements of avant guard to work with my shape. (Asymmetry comes to mind). I need to isolate the elements of the style that appeals and see which ones work with my own persona and person.

Thnx Suz for the reassurance! I can't imagine wanting to dress the way I do if my personality was the opposite: I'd probably find my clothes cloying. LOL

Thanx Una, fascinating thread, indeed.
I chimmed in to say that after more than half a decade on YLF plus intensely and purposefully working on/with my wardrobe this year was the first year when I achived a kind of perpetual pleasure by dressing myself.
I always loved clothes, and payed attention on my dressing, but it was in my late 30s that I felt my clothes do not reflect my inside(and outside) persona and my then actual phisical caracteristics. It have had probably to do with the natural process of ageing wich scared me as I was then experiencing it suddenly and exponentially.
So, I decided to take things (I mean my wardrobe only:-)) under control and do my best.
Now, I feel I achieved a state where I can dress every day to fit/reflect my actual body and moods, functions and weather conditions, my inside/outside persona in a more intelligible way, and cover even some of my fantasy life moments, too.
As Anne said, me too- I am still having hard times putting down in words my coveted fashion persona/style, BUT how about actually feeling I am on the good way, if not already achived it (in my own perceptions only, of course).

It's not at all about what others think about, but what I feel I worked on so hard, and so I will not shy myself to feel (most days)fabulous!:-)

Thanx again, Angie and YLF!

Ah Suz, I was looking at a narrower definition of harmony I completely agree that wearing things that work for us is paramount but IMO that doesn't just mean wearing clothes someone says look good on you. The article says style is your relationship to yourself fashion is about clothes & their relationship to the moment.
This rings so true for me.

Fantastic thread. So much to digest and think through that I can't seem to formulate a literate or concise thought in response, but I just want to say a huge thank you, Una and E, for starting and continuing this fascinating discussion!

Like shemarie, I can't formulate anything to say right now, but I wanted to acknowledge your thread Una. I've been following it all day and ruminating on its contents. Very good stuff. If anything, I identify with Suz's first comment. I think I'm looking for a style that jives with my physicality, instead of the other way around. Of course it can't announce something untruthful about me, because that would feel inauthentic to me, and like a costume.

Interesting discussion. Sign me up to be Elizabeth Bennet (perhaps in a past life).