I suspect that if I truly give up coffee for real, a lot of desire for sweets will diminish or disappear. There's so much of a psychological association between the two of them; it screams out comfort to me. I have many great suggestions to try out bit by bit here. I'm really appreciative. Thanks again.

Giving up coffee? Now that's just crazy talk.

Seriously, I would cry if someone made me give up coffee. I only drink the equivalent of one caffeinated cup a day (I make half reg, half decaf), but it makes my morning.

Oh, yeah - I forgot - I eat almost NO refined simple carbs like bread, pasta, white rice. I stopped, basically, with LE. I DO eat some (limited) whole grains and I do eat sweet potatoes and potatoes.

Don't get me wrong. I if I am on vacation in Paris, you'd better believe I'm going to eat baguette and lemon tart and I ate some rice and noodles in China. And I'm not going to turn down my friend's lovingly prepared shortbread a couple of times a year. But refined carbs are not my daily staples any more, if you know what I mean. It's not part of my habitual life. Cutting this stuff way back completely cured me of my insane insulin spikes and crashes and reduced my desire for sweets as well.

I do think coffee is an appetite stimulant for some of us. Some people use it instead of food but that has never worked for me. I definitely get a buzz off coffee + sugary food too, so I can understand getting addicted to that, I just don't happen to love the feeling (or the crash 2 hours later).
Two things I have done that helped me cut back on sugar (mostly baked goods in my case, consumed mid-afternoon when I have a mental and physical low):
- cut back coffee, which I truly love, to one only in the morning
- developed an interest in loose leaf tea. I like dessert-flavoured black teas with milk and, yes, sugar. But I figure a teaspoon of sugar or honey falls far short in calories of a cookie, chocolate bar or other sweet food! The little bit of caffeine gives me a boost too. I also love rooibos lattes but I found they made me sleepy. I came to look forward to my mid-afternoon tea as much as any calorie-laden treat. I enjoy seeking out new "gourmet" loose leaf flavours & blends but also love a basic cup of bagged Tetley orange pekoe.

I still bake and eat sweet treats, but I've managed to develop some moderation around it, slowly over the years, along with some healthy habits I actually enjoy - breakfasts with protein, fat (eggs or peanut butter) and/or slow burning carbs like oatmea; salad + protein for lunch, with full-fat oil & vinegar salad dressings. I love these foods and don't feel deprived, I am not rigid in following any rules, they are more habits. Along with very half-assed attempts to exercise consistently, I am actually very slowly but surely losing weight.

Thanks for reminding me, Jules. If you go to stores like Tevana, they have a lot of teas with a slightly sweet flavor, but it's from the different things in the tea. I love to drink the Azteca fire in the evening because it has a slightly sweet and chocolate taste. It's enough to satisfy my chocolate/sugar craving, but it only has a few nibs in it.

Hey mochi well umm i kinda have that sweet attacks as i call it. See even since i was a kid my parents pretty much didn't control my sugar intake. I really don't like chocolate but sweet? geez i love candies, candies, and over sweet food such like cakes. when i was 115 i weighten 90 pounds but when i came to the USA geez from 115 pounds i went 145 in less than 2 years and i can see why ...I used to eat danish bread like, my weekly 20 dollars that dad used to give me was for bags of candies!!! no kidding and 2 icecreams a day. To the point i was 160 for a 5'4 i was pretty thick but still with flat stomach ...i started seen my family health history and pretty much there are a lot hederitary diabietics. I was scared to turn diabietic ... i pretty much cut all my sugars drastically and started losing pounds what i do to not fall again that once in a while do still is... Absolutely no Candies at home, I have a two year old at home and i wanna give my example, so instead light string cheese and fruits are in my house, no sugar jello ...I know my body needs sugar but i eat grapes and strawberries those are good with vitamine C and calms my cravings so try to prepare them in a ziplog bag when u get a craving and i'm allowed to eat (in my mind) only a special ocation like my baby gio get a kitkat half of the little package once a month and i try to get everything reduced fat and low in sugar...I tried those figs cakes newtons geez those r horrible! but when it's grocery time just eat well before and avoid cookies, cake and overly sweet section, make a list before u go and if u are freaking out just grab sum yougurts ! You can do it!

Yup, Siniestra, I hear your story too.

Well, the good thing is that last night and this morning I spent some time perusing the Primal blog Raisin linked to (Mark's Daily Apple) and I ate very cleanly today. Apart from some sweet potato and a few grapes, no added sugar. I ate good fats so my blood sugar was steady and I didn't have any cravings, even when I had my coffee. So let's hope....thanks again, everyone!

Yay! And one day at a time.

Healthy fats might be key.

I go wonky without my fats. Seriously. Can go without added sugars but ask me to go no added fat? GRRRRRRRRRRR

Yep, it makes all the difference, and that's in one day. I didn't crave sugar and could have my cup of coffee too I had my full-fat greek yogurt and earlier some eggs, etc etc. The only thing hard for me to imagine is eating red meat. I guess I could get by on chicken and fish and occasional bacon. Not a huge fan of steak. Otherwise this is not a hard plan to follow and really is recommending lots of veggies and a little fruit if you want it. We'll see how it goes and whether it helps me to lose weight but even just kicking sugar would be worth it.

Mochi I'm not a steak person either. We do ground beef a lot though, it's easy to incorporate into things, so it's not like a hunk of red meat. Also love pork chops and ground pork, bacon, chicken, turkey and fish. Also eggs! Great for breakfast and I put hard boiled ones on salads, with chicken and olive oil too. Lotsa fat, but good fat! Glad to hear you had a good day and the sugar cravings weren't at you!

Hi Mochi
Sweets are a big problem for me. I can't say I've been able to give them up completely but I need to do several things to keep it in check:
1. Keep my environment super clean. Sorry,kids, we do not keep ice cream, cake, cookies or candy in the house. Except for about 3 or four days a year.
2. Plan ahead. DO not sabotage myself by saying things like: "Well, I'l just go to this bakery around lunch time and see what happens." I know what will happen.
3. Take a pile of supplements including green tea extract, cinnamon bark extract, chromium, vitamin d, and omega 3. Take them before you eat each meal with a big glass of water. Seems to help.
4. Cut out caffeine. I stopped when I got a gastro bug about 6 months ago. Miss it once in a while,but herbal tea is amazing and it really does seem to cut my cravings.
5. Eat dark chocolate every day. I actually eat chocolate that is made of cocoa and acai berry juice, so no white sugar. SO satisfying and packed with antioxidants. EVery. day.

It's very hard. but it actually took me a long time to admit that I was almost powerless over sweets, and it was a big step.

Best of luck!

I am absolutely convinced that the best, easiest-in-the-long-run method is to cut out sweets entirely. I once went a whole year without sugar and it was surprisingly easy once I had detoxed.

Failing that, what I do these days is indulge, but only in sweets that are REALLY REALLY SUPER SUPER GOOD. No Snickers bars for me -- if I'm gonna eat chocolate, it's going to be the best, most amazing chocolate I can get my hands on. I plan it, I savor it, and when it's over, it's over. I don't keep it in the house, I go out and get it and plan how, when and where I am going to enjoy it. E.g. a decadent dessert while out to dinner, or one or two pieces of candy from my favorite candy store down the street.

Another suggestion is to eat a few squares of very very dark chocolate every day. Satisfying, not too sugary, and feels very decadent.

I'm the worst when it comes to sweets - always have been. Several years ago, I started with Atkins and then veered into "Paleo-ish" - managed to ditch about 110lbs in the process.

I would *highly* recommened a Paleo-ish/Primal style eating plan to help you nix those sweet cravings. By the way, if you're not a fan of red meat, you don't need to eat it - you just want to avoid the most processed/highly refined "fluffy" carbs (as I call them).

My general rule is all the fruit, vegetables, nuts, eggs, meat and fish I want. I'll occasionally throw in half a baked sweet potato, and sometimes I even eat those Larabars (if I'm going to the gym or something like that).

Because of starting out with "low carb/Atkins" - I have a bit of a bias in that I choose lower carb fruits and vegetables most of the time. This isn't to say that I don't eat the odd bit of higher-carb fruit, just that I don't choose bananas day in and day out - favouring blueberries instead. Usually just one fruit 'serving' per day is my limit.

In my experience, it'll take a good three to five days of solid "lower-carb, Paleo-ish, Primal-ish" eating to nix those sweet cravings for good. Try not to eat fruit all by itself - have it with a meal that contains protein and fat. My breakfast this morning was scrambled eggs with a 'side' of fresh blueberries.

Also - hate to say it, but diet drinks/pop are awful when it comes to keeping the cravings for sweets going. I used to be a Diet Coke fiend. Ditched it in favour of real brewed unsweetened iced tea with a lemon wedge, and when I crave that 'ahhh' of pop, I'll have an ice cold mini bottle of Pellegrino instead of Diet Coke. Another nice treat is Knudsen brand Just Juice Pure Cranberry (extremely tart and concentrated) - splash just two ounces over ice in a tall glass, top with still water or Pellegrino and a lime wedge. Extremely refreshing in the summer months - and doesn't trigger the sweet cravings. Warning: it's tart - but sooo good!

If you want to speed up the process (ie. get away from the sweet cravings sooner, rather than later) - skip the fruit for the first week. Go low-carb, Paleo-ish,Primal-ish for three to five days and the cravings will literally be gone. After that, you can ease into a more sustainable plan (Primal Blueprint/Paleo or other favourite plan). Don't skimp on the fat that first week - it's the key to feeling satisfied and not going nuts looking for dessert-like foods.

Also - if you're going to eat dairy foods, choose only the smallest portions of the highest fat dairy items. The low-fat dairy foods contain higher sugar (lactose is milk sugar) and will keep those cravings going. Real cream instead of skim milk. Seriously good cheese - but just a tiny portion. Put some high quality grated asiago or parmesan atop roasted green vegetables (ie. asparagus or broccoli florets) - treat the cheese as a condiment.

I'm just getting back on track myself, and have managed to lose three pounds since Sunday...here's what I've been eating:

Breakfast - scrambled eggs, 1/2 cup fresh blueberries (not together, just a small bowl scrambled eggs and a mini bowl of berries)

Lunch - big salad: organic baby romaine lettuce mix, chopped up green onion ends, sliced English cucumber, kalamata olives, grape tomatoes, olive-oil packed tuna, homemade creamy balsamic dressing - all whisked together in a big mixing bowl and transferred to salad plate

Dinner - some sort of meat/fish/chicken with a pile of veggies - eg. Greek lemon marinated boneless pork chop (olive oil, Greek seasoning, lemon juice, grated lemon rind, marinate for as long as you have, then bake in the oven on a rack for about 35 minutes), roasted baby carrots and broccoli florets. Might goop on a bit of the homemade creamy balsamic dressing.

Because it's not "low fat" - I don't really feel like I'm on a diet, if that makes sense.

Meanwhile, I've been at this for a long time, so am trying to remember what it was like before - and thinking back - I think it would be important to go fairly low-carb, higher fat for the first three to five days to get rid of those nasty sweets cravings. It'll totally work. Omelet for breakfast, tuna salad for lunch, meat/fish and a lower-carb vegetable dish for dinner. If having a tough time with cravings, throw in some macadamia nuts for a snack if need be.

I was well over 250 lbs. when I started, and it was important to go "luxe" at first - brie and asparagus omelet for breakfast, tuna salad with mayo at lunch, steak, mushrooms and broccoli for dinner, topped with blue cheese! Insane, but it worked (cravings disappeared completely). Over time, I graduated over to a more Paleo/Primal diet. I find Paleo to be healthier and I feel better on it, but in terms of nixing those sweet cravings - you might be wise to try an Atkins-style variation just for the first week. If you don't like steak, have chicken or fish instead.

Having said that - there is a good chance that starting with Primal Blueprint/Paleo-ish will work just as well - it's just that when I started there wasn't much info on Paleo, and it seemed soooo strict to me back then. It's actually not that strict at all - much more generous than Atkins, as far as I'm concerned.

Nixing the sweet cravings involves eliminating sugar and eliminating those other things that keep the cravings going - for example, diet yogurt, diet pop, pretty much the 'diet' version of anything, come to think of it. Much better to eat less of the non-diet foods, imo. When thinking of carbs - choose those that are whole/natural. There's a world of difference between some carrots or blueberries compared to macaroni or other 'fluff'. If the carbs are 'natural' (ie. they came that way from the earth) then you're good to go. Big difference between cinnamon-dusted, roasted butternut squash versus whatever Lean Cuisine comes out with.

In the meantime, I'm thrilled to read that you tried some ideas from Mark's Daily Apple/ Primal Blueprint and noticed that you felt just fine all day long - woo hoo!

Just keep going - it'll work! I can tell that you're determined and I *know* you'll be successful at this whole thing, no matter what plan/eating style you end up with. Speaking of which, my "plan" is kind of a hybrid of all sorts of things - and I think that's what ultimately happens to most people who embark on a new journey to health. I guess it's kind of like fashion/style too? There is no set formula that works for every single person, but there is all kinds of amazing experience, advice and help available. I think the same is true of diets in general.

I'm excited to read that reading Mark's Daily Apple blog helped - because it's just this type of thing that has been working for me too. Keep reading, experimenting

...sorry for the novel.

Shout out to Zapotee...ice cream is my Kriptonite! I try not to even have it in the house, but rather if the family wants it, we'll go for a walk to the local dairy bar for a treat.

I only eat 'real ' food, and I cook from scratch. I grow some of my own veggies, and lots of herbs. I source the best quality food I can get. We rarely eat out, and pack lunches for work all the time. There aren't any food places within 5 miles of where we work!

I don't think there is anything I won't eat, but I do try to keep portions reasonable. A little wine, a little chocolate, is ok. For a feeling of satiation, I volumize with lots of vegetables. I do try to get a little protein at breakfast, even if it is just a dab of PB on toast, and I get most of my carbs earlier in the day. Like several folks who have posted, I would rather eat less and higher quality.

Food is such a hard thing! With most addictions/temptations, you can just abstain. Not food.

This thread is a wealth of knowledge and I come back daily to read the new posts. Mochi, thank you so much for starting it and to everyone for contributing such detailed information and guidance.

I find that a glass of diet soda will curb my occasional craving for a sweet but for me it is the taste that I occasionally seem to need. i agree that artificial sweeteners are not healthy in any way but then neither is refined sugar and the cup of diet orange soda doesn't trigger a binge like a scoop of ice cream would.

I started eating "clean" last week and have made a pot of chicken vegetable soup every few days. I use chicken breast with the bone in and add an onion, carrots, celery and diced tomato to the mix. When it is done, it is half vegetable and very thick and hearty. Last night, I wasn't hungry but had that need to eat so I had a mug of soup and it satisfied the craving while adding a few ounces of lean protein and some good veggies to my daily intake.

Because I had to have a large portion of my colon removed and am high risk for colon cancer, my doctor suggested I target 35 grams of fiber per day. I use quinoa and brown rice in my meals. I am not sure I could make it without the healthy grains.

What I find most fascinating about this discussion is how the dietary needs and wants vary so much. It really highlights the importance of tracking what you eat and how you feel to determine what is best for your body.

I'm getting a huge shot of varied and valuable information too, dianthus. It will be cool if gradually more and more people find the thread because many people out there have successfully gotten off sugar (which to me sounds nearly impossible) and many of us who haven't, probably need to cut back.

I also have colon cancer in my family history (no surgery yet--had a few polyps removed). That's the only thing about Primal/Paleo that concerns me; the orthodox view is that we should abstain from, or eat much less, fats and animal products. I'm sure Primal devotees can find studies that counter this. I don't want them to turn out to be wrong!

I feel like the only person in the world for whom dark chocolate holds very little appeal. Most of it is just too bitter for me.

My hopelessly pedestrian tastebuds could go to town with a bag of Hershey kisses though. I guess that's the sugar talking.

Janet, I was just thinking about this today. Dark chocolate holds the same appeal as coffee grounds. Well, practically. A "darker" milk chocolate (35-40% cocoa) is what really does it for me., and semi-sweet chocolate isn't too bad either.

But I'll eat Hershey's kisses too. I did grow up on cheap, second-rate Christmas and Easter chocolates.

ETA: when I think of what my sister and I used to crave as little kids, this die-hard sugar junkie gets a little queasy. Cadbury Eggs, all sorts of scary treats......

I do think different approaches work for different people, especially if a person has a particular health issue or needs to lose excess weight fairly quickly.

But, to me, making major changes in your current diet makes sense only if you can realistically maintain those changes for years, not just weeks or months, otherwise the health issues or extra weight will return as soon as you start eating "normally" again or give in to "temptation".

What people chose to eat is an individual choice but, after living through half a century of weird food trends, I get leery of magic solutions that will solve everyone's health and weight issues. Eat, or don't eat, sugar, fat, dairy, red meat, processed food, salt, wheat, and their ilk--but also take the time to figure out what is right for your body and will work in the long term for your lifestyle. And do your own research before you make your choices. The Internet can be a wonderful source of information but it also can popularize a lot of weird and dubious claims.

Short answer: No, no luck in kicking the habit.

Long answer: I've done well when other people have planned or prepared my food for me. I did eDiets for a long time - both where they just plan out all your food for the day and the program where they actually prepare the food and send it to you. But the latter is expensive and my life is too much of a crush for me to do all that cooking these days. So, at this moment, I'm out of luck.

Well, this is certainly a fun thread! And my worlds are colliding, as I am a great lover of Mark's Daily Apple, and the primal / paleo way of living.

Mochi, I will not reiterate things others have already covered. I will just add that for me and my husband, the detox from sugar and bad, high-glycemic carbs, took a good three weeks. During that time we felt yucky, we missed the carbs and sugars, and the critters living in our guts craved them desperately. Then one day we woke up, and we felt ... WONDERFUL. No cravings, zesty, grounded. Those three weeks of flu symptoms were totally worth it.

As a previous sugar addict, I can honestly say after that I didn't crave sugar (or breads).

Raisin has lots of great info, and I agree with her assessment completely. It's very hard to master the primal diet, but it's absolutely wonderful to keep returning to it, even if I never master it.

I attribute my 40lb weight loss using Weight Watchers directly to curbing my carb addiction. These days I have 2-3 fruits a day, which seems to help curb the desire for other sweets. About every other month when PMS is setting in I do crave and indulge in one piece of dark chocolate for about 3 days... Funny that I don't crave it every month... I do not feel the cravings at all.

That said after returning from my trip to Grand Cayman, I could not stop eating every carb I could get my hands on including sugar... My WW leader said this was common. Funny since I ate really well on the trip, but the addition of alcohol nightly is what probably triggered the carb monster!

Good Luck and I hope you don't have to give up the coffee!

Just a thought... if weight loss is your goal, I believe the thing about where they say some people do better cutting carbs and some cutting fats. I'm a cut the fat person when it comes to weight loss. The thing about *sweets,* though, is that sweets often come high both in fat and carbs. So if it's just the sweet taste you're after, you might find success eating things that taste sweet but which are low in fat. Also how sweet a thing tastes is not related to how high it is in carbs, so it's possible to have the sweet taste and lower the carbs.

Oh, also, increasing fiber helps slow down the sugar rush that goes straight to fat.

It's great hearing all the different approaches. Thanks! I started doing the Primal eating plan about four or five days ago and it seems to be doing something. I am not craving sugar--haven't had any at all, or wanted it very strongly. At this point, I'm definitely eating high fat. That's what is recommended and it truly does help eliminate the cravings. I feel satisfied. I've been delving into the Primal blogspot Raisin recommended and people have been having astonishing results, really trim and athletic and healthy and vibrant-looking. It seems trustworthy and science-minded. I will give updates if the weight starts coming off for real. To me it's not a hard way to eat at all (I am used to cooking from scratch). We'll see how it goes.

And I'm still having my daily coffee. With light cream.

Yay, so glad to hear you're doing well Mochi! Hope you get the results you are after. It does feel good just to have a steady flow of energy all day and not be riding the sugar roller-coaster, though.

Keep going, Mochi! It gets easier!

Finally getting around to adding to this thread - great discussion Mochi (and everyone) with a wealth of information and ideas.

Before anything else, I'm wondering Mochi if you have had your hormone levels and insulin levels checked? When my insulin is out of balance (part of my endocrine disorder), I can eat sweets until I'm literally sick to my stomach - can't seem to stop myself and the craving is overwhelming. I have been known to eat an entire bag of Oreo cookies in one sitting. Now I'm not saying there's anything physical wrong here, but it might be worth ruling out a physical connection to the craving before delving into other possibilities? Just a suggestion.

Part of maintaining a healthy endocrine balance for me involves eating quite a low glycemic diet - very little in the way of simple carbs since my body processes those incorrectly. I have found this to be very helpful in the way of sugar cravings.

Coffee is a definite appetite stimulant for me so I now have a cup in the car on the way to work but don't drink it at my desk, otherwise I might want to head to the cafeteria (which is dangerously close) for a cinnamon bun or piece of fudge to go with it.

Adding the lean protein and veggies to my morning smoothie has helped alot with my mid-morning snacking. The sweetness of the fruit and almond milk in the smoothie seems to make my brain think I've already had something sweet and I don't need anything more.

You'll find what works for you Mochi - I know it!

So glad to read that this seems to be working for you Mochi!

Also wanted to say that I think what rachylou says is very wise. I *do* get my 'sweet' fix, just that it comes in the form of blueberries, strawberries, raspberries, blackberries etc. I think rachylou might be onto something by saying that a lot of sweet treats are high in fat and sugar/carbs. Same is true of stuff like onion rings or whatever...high fat + high carb seems to be a difficult combination to resist.

I suppose this might be why different approaches work - a lower fat approach will work because you're not combining high fat with higher carb items, and likewise, a lower carb approach will work because - you're doing the same thing, only in reverse...higher fat, lower carb intake.

I had a "treat" on Valentine's Day - my husband brought me some fancy schmancy sorbet from Whole Foods. It was Talenti Roman Raspberry. Definitely higher in carb than would be acceptable "on plan" - but the thing is, I just had a half cup serving and the rest of the container is still in the freezer! Unheard of (for me). I wonder if that's because it wasn't "high fat + high carb" all at once. It did stall my weight loss for a day or two, but did *not* trigger ridiculous sweet cravings that I'd be battling for days and days. To me, that's a real win!

Just something to file away for future reference - rachylou's most likely 100% right that the most craving-inducing foods are those that combine high fat and carbs together. I've never been particularly inclined to overeat blueberries

Hang in there, and I'm so glad to hear that you're finding a way to beat the sugar cravings - YAY!

Mochi, I just found this post and can't answer very completely now, but want you to be very strong. You don't want to have diabetes to get serious about this and carbs like rice and pasta are just sugar in disguise. In fact, as a diabetic, rice is about the worst thing I can eat. For others it's potatoes, etc.
i've always been a sugar addict and didn't worry because I was thin and none of the disease in the family. I was a fool.. Now when I crave something I have to balance it against having my foot or functioning kidneys or eyesight, etc. that's motivation.
It gets easier. Your palate adjusts so that cinnamon tastes sweet. I don't use artificial sweeteners at all as they add to the craving. Instead I mix cinnamon into plain yogurt, oatmeal, etc. Fiber is your friend for controlling blood glucose. It also helps to eat a practically no carb meal of fish and green veggies, then allow myself about three slow savored tiny bites of something like dark chocolate. I don't feel deprived and stay on track.
i'd highly recommend seeing a dietician because eating low carb can be complicated. If not, the South Beach diet is close and healthy. Count carbs, not calories, and everything falls into place. I meal for a woman is 30-45 carbs with a couple of 15 carb snacks with about 10 G protein so it stays with you. Nuts or low carb yogurt is good.
Wishing you the best with this. The cravings will always be there, but in time I found the idea of the craved food more powerful than the actual taste which wasn't as good as I remembered it being. Hardest thing to give up...wine and beer. No carbonated beverages for you, even diet.

Glad to read your post Joy, not that I'm glad you're diabetic. But I am sure that's the road I am or was headed down. Except in my family there is a strong history of diabetes. You're right though, being thin has nothing to do with it, and doesn't give (me) carte Blanche to eat every sugar in sight. I've been off track for a couple weeks now, so it's very motivational to me to read that to get back on track. Gosh, it's so hard to give up though! Now, I have to try to keep away from my kids Easter candy for the next week.....lol