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Advocating For Myself at Work

lyn*

(website)

Veteran

I try not to post my work shenanigans on a public forum, but this one doesn't concern any patients at all - this concerns the other people that I work with.

I just plotted out my new year (we start July 1st, like all residents do) and I have planned my vacation (5 weeks + 1 week of Christmas or New Years) in even increments this year. Last year I didn't do this and now I actually have about 9 vacation days I cannot use.

I feel that for the sake of my own mental health (and consequently better patient care) that I need to spread out my breaks and use them. I plan to take two weeks in September, and again in December and again in March (piggy back with a conference leave for Vienna!)

I realize that it may be super aggressive to submit a whole YEAR of requests at a time, but I think I've realized that if I don't ask for it, I'll never get it, and I'll be the one that gets shafted in the end when everyone else submits their requests. Even though, it's really hard to be able to ask for things. Luckily, this is just an email I have to send (and already have done so).

Do you wise ladies have any ideas how to advocate for yourself in terms of having a fair workload without everyone else being angry about it? (Possibly an imaginary fear, no one has been angry yet; possibly the only one feeling guilty is myself too!)

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30 replies

Latest reply was from lyn*

Anonymous

I don't see anything wrong with submitting your requests for te year. It makes it easier for a manager to schedule anyhow.

annagybe

(website)

Veteran

Do it!

I once resquested 2 1/2 weeks off at Christmas and New Year's so that my Dad and I could go to Australia. I did it a full year in advance. Also I did not take any other vacation that year.
I'm realizing the longer I work in healthcare, I need more frequent breaks. Otherwise it seriously grinds you down.

Aida

Veteran

Lyn my husband does something similar as well (he usually has extra vacation days as he doesn't take much time off either). He's started taking a week off here and there to use those vacay days, and to make sure that there are actual breaks or he just gets sucked into workworkwork. He also often takes nearly all of Dec. off, which is pretty incredible. I don't know that he submits a full year at a time but his work is probably less schedule oriented than yours I don't see how they could possibly be angry at you. I mean, I know that I'd want MY docs to have the best mental health possible and that means taking the breaks that they need yes?

Caro in Oz

Veteran

It's so hard but we can't never control how people are going to react to anything we do. They would have to be insane imo to not want their health professionals working at their peak.

It really isn't selfish, you need look after yourself before you can look after your patients.

Isabel

Veteran

Lyn, I am so glad that you are doing this ! I just want to say that you have no control whether or not people get angry. You cannot possibly write an email that could predict and address others' reactions. Nor should you. Have fun !!!!!

Gigi

Veteran

I'm glad you're going this for yourself too, Lyn! I don't have any advice from experience, as I've never worked in a heavily schedule-oriented field like yours, but I think you're approaching it in the right way. You need to be honest with yourself, and the truth is that you know that you need more breaks to be functioning well for your patients. That is not selfish but simply admitting the truth, and it also keeps patient care at the forefront. If someone gets nasty, I would just remind yourself that the patients are the ones who benefit the most from a well-rested doc. This is not selfish at all but just admitting your mental health needs.

deb

Veteran

I think you should do it this year and see how it goes. Like you said, your concerns may not even materialize. If you do get negative feedback from a few (I cannot imagine all), you will know how to address the issue next year. It will also give you practice standing up for yourself. I think we all travel this road at the beginning of our careers and the only way we learn is by doing.

WingGirl

If you don't plan it far in advance, you will always have to plan around everyone else's time off. I totally understand how it might feel awkward. But remember, time off is part of your compensation package! You earned it.

rabbit

Veteran

There are fields where the unspoken assumption is that an employee NOT take earned vacation or at least be willing to drop it and work instead if a deadline comes up. This is toxic and one of the things I hate most about the work environment in the US. I think the earlier you can establish boundaries that are fair but humane to yourself the better, it can be really hard to start establishing them once supervisors and clients are used to you basically being permanently available.

crutcher

Veteran

If you don't advocate for yourself, planning your leave time and scheduling it, who will?...Its a hard lesson, but I have learned if I don't take care of myself, speak up for me, watch out for what I need, there is NO one out there who is going to do it...You have to be your own best friend...That is all that needs to be said..
Enjoy those precious days...

Kim

Veteran

No one else will have your best interest at heart, more than you. They will always have their own interest first, (it's normal) just like you should. It's not mean, it's actually doing them a favor because if you burn out at your job, you'll be taking time off when it's least convenient for EVERYONE.

Having regular breaks to look forward to make working those long tough days a little easier, and you'll come back from your break with renewed vigor and a fresh attitude toward your work. What patient wouldn't want that in their doctor?

You need to be firm, and set your boundaries now, as was stated above. Nothing wrong with that at all. It's simply being proactive for your OWN mental health. Smart girl!!

And VIENNA??? Lucky lady!!

And what would DR LYN say to her own patient, who came in with this issue?? Listen to her! LOL

kerry

Veteran

I agree with Rabbit. I live in Canada but I think we have a similar work culture to the US. Some people don't want to take the time off because they get a lot of external validation from the work they do and don't want to think they are dispensable for even a week. Many people wear a work-aholic tendency and exhaustion as a badge of honour.

Since you don't know yet how people will react, I think it's useful to look inward. What is it about your attitudes toward work that are making you feel guilty? Do you feel bad when you take care of yourself? You are in a healthcare field where you are always giving. You've got to fill the tank so that you can do this effectively. Aren't those in healthcare notoriously bad at taking proper care of themselves? Is this the badge of honour those in your field carry?

Boundary setting is hard. You can only do it effectively when you are clear about what is important to you. A little soul searching is in order, perhaps?

TraceyLiz65

(website)

Veteran

Our own self care is of utmost importance and there is absolutely nothing wrong with being a planner and submitting it for the entire year. That seems like a normal action depending on personality type and very reasonable to do so. Just claim it as that and don't worry about it!

Louise

Veteran

This is a great idea x

kkards

Veteran

i think most employers are happy to have an employee give them so much advance notice on vacation schedules. in fact, some places with scheduling issues like your mandate it.

Eliza

Veteran

In your field, failure to plan vacation ensures that you can't take what you are entitled to have. It is actually a courtesy to plan ahead, so that no one is scrambling at the last minute. Do your peers do ask in advance? Do others have significant vacation days unused? It could be that colleagues will follow your lead. That may be a good thing, in terms of sorting out necessary coverage and number of people out at any given time.

Overall, simmering resentment and lack of breaks do not contribute to a productive work environment. I think we will all look back at the days before everyone was reachable for work 24/7, around the globe, longingly. There is no sanctuary unless we create it for ourselves. Good luck with this.

MsMary

Veteran

DO IT!!

I feel very fortunate in that in my workplace the rule about vacation time is "use it or lose it," and we are encouraged to actually use it. We always say the reason we have a lot of vacation time is that our jobs are very demanding and we NEED that time off!!

In my last work site we all had a meeting at the beginning of the year and everybody brought their calendars and agreed on who would be off when. It was a good system because everybody got at least some of the specific days they wanted, and the workload was always reasonably covered. In my new work site I am pretty much a self-contained unit in that when I'm gone it just shuts down, so I don't really have to coordinate with anybody, which makes it super easy to plan for time off.

But anyway... DO IT!!

lyn*

(website)

Veteran

Thanks ladies for your advice, and yes, Kim, Dr. Lyn would be like, come on, USE IT. So I have submitted my vacation requests over the next year!

Over the last two years, I have noticed my colleagues be very "sneaky" with their vacation requests; bridging it over stat holidays, for example to get extra days. The people who didn't know you could this would overall get about 4 less vacation days in a year (myself included) and we'd be working these extra shifts for others.

It's also not very hard to get a doctor's note for chunks of time off here (go to a walk-in doctor and they can give you up to two weeks for about $25/note); and I have found this to be soul crunching when I am working their extra shifts and they post pictures of their tropical vacation on Facebook.

Losing my vacation days this year has left a real sour note with me - like Ms Mary's work, we are use it or lose it - so I'm going to use mine up for sure next year!

Our current policy is "six weeks in advance" but that's not true, because the call schedule comes out three months in advance - so it's really three months in advance. I'm submitting my entire requests now with my first time off in September, so I should be fine either way.

Thank you for your guidance

Carla

Veteran

About 5 years ago my workplace clamped down with a fairly rigid vacation policy. In January you submit your request for vacation dates April to September, and in June for dates October through March. There are specific staffing requirements and if too many people ask for the same dates, seniority rules. Some teams do what MsMary wrote about, and have a meeting so that folks who are more flexible can accommodate those with special events, etc.

This year an even stricter edict came out for the summer months - June through mid September, staffing to be at 80%, resulting in lots of folks (yours truly included) having their requests denied! Flex time/compressed work weeks were suspended. This resulted in folks who still wanted shorter work weeks booking their vacation days Monday and/or Friday, leaving T-W-Th for the rest! Very hard feelings amongst staff about this.

Once the kids no longer factored into our vacation plans, DH and I shifted to shoulder seasons. April and Sept/Oct are good times to travel. Unfortunately DH's busy time at his place of work doesn't quite mesh with mine, so we both end up carrying extra time. Mine accumulates but DH looses some of his.

Lyn, in the kind of work you do, it is probably better to commit ahead of time and plan the break, otherwise you will just keep putting it off and wear yourself out.

lyn*

(website)

Veteran

Ugh, there are some people here who do the M and F vacation time too; and it grinds my gears really badly.

I like to travel in November (when there are more steep sales because it's the "winter" season - and I'm not going to boil to death in Hong Kong); so I guess it does work out in that way for me. I'm slightly happier I don't have to plan vacation time with a partner in mind these days - it'd be nearly impossible to mesh up two schedules.

I kind of wish we had an 80% staffing requirement - we are almost down to 60% during some parts of the year and with graduated duties (the seniors do less duties) it really hurts when 75% of people away are junior staff. Of course they ask the juniors to pick up more (even though we are already doing more) because the seniors can't do that - oh no, heaven forbid they work one weekend out of the month when we work three of four.

Deborah

Veteran

You can lose your leave if you don't use it?? Here our leave accrues (none of this if you don't take it you lose it), and all my employers have been positive and encouraging about taking leave. Sounds like our legal entitlements might be quite different. I think you are being wise Lyn.

Alassë

Veteran

Yes, I think planning in advance & requesting it this earlier is a good idea. It's hard to come across as angry about your schedule/vacation time when it's a "yearly plan" email! I hope your spread-out-breaks schedule works out well for you; it sounds like an excellent plan.

DonnaF

Veteran

If anyone complains, explain sweetly that you weren't able to use nine days of your earned vacation this year, and that you didn't cut corners/work the system to get additional days.

You absolutely need to ask for and monitor your vacation requests when you would be competing with others, like over the December holidays.

So there's no way to take any of those nine days here and there in June? Might not mean you would have the chunk of time to go anywhere, but at least it would be more time to call your own.

lyn*

(website)

Veteran

I have patients booked in between now and the end of June so I don't think it's fair to them for me to suddenly go on 9 days of vacation. I don't really mind working either, because I'm almost done all my call (2 call in 6 weeks is very light) so I'm just kind of cruising. Cruising towards being awesome.

Thistle

Veteran

I am not in healthcare, however, I do manage the Accounting department at my company.

I don't mind at all if an employee gives me their entire schedule for the year at once. I double check it against significant known happenings and then approve or discuss accordingly. Might be the job, though. I expect my team to be organized

ironkurtin

Veteran

You get vacation days because everyone needs work-life balance. Take the days. If people get angry, it's their problem. You are not responsible for thier issues. You have to take care of yourself, because no one else will make you their priority if you don't.

Practice this: "I have plans that cannot be changed."

Kimberley

Veteran

What IK said, for sure!

Glory

Veteran

I work for a company that 3 years ago began requiring people submit their annual vacation plans in one go. They can of course be changed if needed. I support it because prior to that, like you, I lost over 10 days of vacation because I could not squeeze it in. Another year I ended up having to take most of December off - not a hardship but not well planned when I could have spent some of the summer with the kids. I say go for it and know that there are companies out there that do this.

Anonymous

Lyn, I think this is a brilliant idea. Particularly given your profession, I think you need to view vacation as an absolute necessity for your physical and mental health rather than a "luxury" that puts other people out. I completely get where you're coming from -- for most of my working life, I've put off vacation. It's only in the last few years that I've been to recognize how unhealthy that situation becomes not only for me, but for everyone around me (family, coworkers, friends). You can't keep giving and giving if you're never recharged. As Anna pointed out, scheduling everything out for the year is easier for a manager to work around than later requests. And you get the added benefit of knowing you have vacation to look forward to!

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