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What is casual?

Suz

(website)

Veteran

In Krista's thread here, Day Vies commented:

"I feel confused now because these looks are my idea of casual but I know that I have some friends who believe these looks are "dressed up" and I would be asked "where are you going?" (in that who do you think you arekind of way). Does anyone else struggle with what exactly casual means?"

I think it's a good question. Krista posted simple, straightforward, yet pulled-together looks that I, personally, would consider casual. Yet I agree with Day Vies, too. A lot of times, when I wear something like that, people still think I am "dressed up."

Typically, this doesn't bother me. I just wear what I want to wear, you know? But Krista was talking specifically about wanting to fit in and feel comfortable in a particular environment on the weekend. And sometimes it's quite important for us to fit in.

I guess there are degrees of "casual" just as there are degrees of formality -- and different environments call for different combinations. It sounds as if Krista has nailed this. But does anyone else struggle with this question?

Dressing

58 replies

Latest reply was from Astrid

Glory

Veteran

I agree - I too would be asked if I was going somewhere. Last year I recall wearing a purple sweater with my jeans at the kids hockey game and I was asked why I was all dressed up....
There are degrees of casual and the requirement is dictated by lifestyle and location. Where I am in lifestyle, daily wear is definately jeans and a top. More would be very dressed up.
If I have a special place to go I could notch it up a bit. I try to have a capsule for those things but in all honestly I use them so infrequently they are often dated by the time I want them again.

Transcona Shannon

Veteran

I think "dressy" or "casual" is completely relative and is based on the situation and the setting.

I used to work in a much more corporate office environment and how I dress now on days with trousers and semi tucked sweaters would be considered casual. However the office I'm in now makes this same outfit completely acceptable. Whereas when I wear a dress and blazer at work, I'm considered over dressed.

Any time I have changed jobs, I always pay attention to how others in the office dress and for the most part, base my dressing to match. However, as I'm gaining more confidence in my style and what I like to wear, I am more likely to throw caution to the wind and dress how I want (as long as it's appropriate) and don't worry as much about "fitting in".

rachylou

Veteran

Oh wait. Let me explain. The world is divided into fancy people and normal people. I know all about this because my mum and bf are normal people (they tell me this is so) and I am fancy people (they tell me this is so).

Normal people wear the same thing all the time except for the occasions when they are born, marry, die... oh and go to church (which is the same difference). This would be mom jeans (the men too), a knit shirt (round scoopneck for women, collars for men), fleece jacket (no no, not the tacky kind you've just thought of), running shoes. They can wear this outfit everywhere they go because they don't go places where you have to wear something else. Those places are a *bit too fancy* (practically morally suspect).

If you are not dressed like this, normal people will say, "a bit dressed up, eh?" This does not mean you are dressed up. This means you are not wearing the outfit above.

I'd like to comment, now, that *normal people* do seem to sneak off and do things like get season tickets to the symphony and dress appropriately, but I'm sure no one would know what I'm talking about...

texstyle

(website)

Veteran

To me casual is pretty much anything I wear just to do regular life activities and can throw in the washer with abandon. Casual is to go shopping, visit a friend, eat at a cafe, etc. Dressy is more for weddings, celebrations, a nice dinner out, maybe going to hear the symphony or attending a business conference.

To me casual includes jeans, khakis, shorts, most of my button downs (except maybe silk or similar items), most of my knit tops, non-heeled shoes, fashion jewelry for the most part, light makeup, etc. And dressy would be my nicer slacks or a skirt with a silk top or other top I wouldn't want to get stained and probably hand wash, heels, better jewelry, more makeup, etc.

Sometimes the items cross over of course.

I try not to dress too much for others unless it is a wedding or similar event where maybe the church or home has some of it's own expectations and I want to be considerate of them. And I guess I wouldn't purposely dress up too much to go to a very casual family event where I might help in the kitchen, play with the kids or dogs and stuff like that. But I wouldn't restrict myself from dressing the way I am comfortable, even if THEY think it's dressier than I should.

If someone says sarcastically "Well don't YOU look snazzy today?" I would simply say "Thank you! I really tried to look nice." Usually ends that conversation. If they press with "Where did you think you were going?" I might even say "I wasn't sure but I thought you might invite me someplace special so I wanted to be ready just in case!"

Nicole D

Veteran

Rachylou you are a hoot! I would call those normal people - "Canadians". I find there are cultural influences too. In some cultures it would jut be unheard of to leave the house in sweatpants, whereas in others dressing up means wearing your "good" sweatpants.

krishnidoux

Veteran

LOL Rachylou!

I admit being very confused about this. I think I know, then I'm proved wrong. People have often told me "You're going somewhere?" just because I felt like wearing my pumps on a given day. If I wear the above described by Rachylou outfit, I feel very frumpy (especially in a round scoopneck!).It has always been like this for me. I have ignored comments all my life. But am still confused.

Beth Ann

Veteran

Suz this is in the forefront of my mind these days, too. I'm often asked, "Why are you so dressed up?," and am rarely complimented. Now, I'm not fishing for compliments when I choose what I wear, but these responses make me fear that I'm missing the environmental boat.

Since I work very little in the Summer, I'm going to try to put together some "really casual, but not pajamas" looks and see if I feel like myself dressed that way. I don't want to be a "poseur," and I would feel like one in plain jeans, a football jersey and Nikes, but I do want to be approachable.

Strangely, this kind of thing also makes me want to move. It's as if I'm out of place, literally. There are lovely people in my suburban community, and I have no desire to change or pass judgment on their lifestyle, but let's just say I'm the only one blasting the neighborhood with operatic arias and watching Doctor Who instead of the Bears game. I sometimes wonder if my "team dressy" persona reveals something about my deeper self that I need to honor. Maybe not with something so drastic as a major move (although that could be coming), but smaller lifestyle choices.

catgirl

Veteran

I commented on that thread too, Suz! It is truly confusing. I could not be more out of place where I live - I get asked all the time if I just moved here. From New York. Haha. I really don't care as long as I'm happy and presentable and not freezing my butt off. Casual is so standard here it's not even a concept. What is presentable casual here is camping gear elsewhere. People go to the opera in Carharrts. It's both refreshing and sad depending on how you look at it.

Anonymous

This is a really good discussion! (I'm ROTFL at Rachylou!) It seems that designers like to play with this and turn out garments that are neither fish nor fowI. A fabric can be casual (rough, rugged, slubbed, nubby, sturdy), but something in a formal silhouette but made of one of these casual fabrics can make it feel casual.

OTH, design details can be casual (rustic buttons, utility zippers, cargo pockets, grommets, gussets). An item could be made with a dressy fabric, but if it had one/some of these design details, it might feel casual.

I tend to think flat shoes are more casual than any heel, but what if the flat is refined leather and the heel is a chunky jute wedge? I tend to think pants or shorts are more casual than a skirt or dress, but what if the pants are silk palazzo pants and the dress is sun-faded denim? There are so many factors and visual clues that make us deem something casual or not. For me it seems to be a gradient, or a sliding scale. I look forward to reading all of the responses!

Liz A.

Veteran

I think what an individual considers casual has a lot to do with what s/he feels most comfortable in. For instance, what do you wear when you are just puttering around the house? I personally wear sweats or yoga pants and a tank top or t-shirt. That is what I feel most comfortable in. There was a long period of time when I would wear these outfits everywhere, including to parties (in high school), and to class (in college), and to the grocery store (up until like a week ago, ok maybe I still do this). Putting on jeans to me feels like making a special effort, although I do still consider this casual. Putting on my work clothes means putting on something I would never choose to wear if I had my way about it.

I say all this to say that I guess I am one of the "normal" people according to Rachylou's mom. But YOUR NORMAL, being what you consider casual, is most probably what you feel most comfortable in. Another way to say it is that what you personally consider to be casual is what you would choose to wear on a daily basis. Now the real question is (and maybe what Suz is really asking) is my casual too casual? Or is her casual too dressy? Angie, where are you?

Caro in Oz

Veteran

What Beth Ann said really resonated with me. My new city is not the same "fit" for me as my old one. I don't have the answer. I guess I have adjusted my clothing to suit to some degree but I know I can't go too far or I feel awful.

Aida

Veteran

What Shannon said: ' "dressy" or "casual" is completely relative and is based on the situation and the setting. ' Geography also seems to play a part, so I'd add that as well. The wearer's comfort level is also involved in whether they feel pressure to further dress down, and some social situations will require sensitivity to how others perceive "casual" to be.

(FWIW, I have no problem wearing pumps to hockey games and have done so )

hedgiehog

Veteran

Suz, this is a great post. I suppose everyone's casual is different depending on where they live and what they feel comfortable in. I completely get where rachylou is coming from. All my life, people have told me I don't know how to dress down. Even in casual settings, I'll be the one who's overdressed. And it's doubly difficult because I live in a super casual environment. I went to the theatre a few weeks ago and was amazed at the number of people wearing jeans and flip flops. I felt like I made an effort so they should have as well. My hubby says it's just the nature of where we live.
I think my idea of casual is "smart casual" and I don't mind being a bit overdressed. I usually receive compliments so I think I'll just keep on the way I am. If I feel comfortable then I'm happy.

cciele

Veteran

Haha, rachylou you crack me up yet again. But rings true to me:
If you are not dressed like this, normal people will say, "a bit dressed up, eh?" This does not mean you are dressed up. This means you are not wearing the outfit above.

Or basically, "You are not wearing what I think is casual."

It's interesting that many people here struggle with their casual capsules. I've wondered why that is--perhaps because of this wide range of definition for casual?

Ariadne

Veteran

Oh, great topic. This is something I think about a lot. I spend the vast majority of my time in an environment that is both ultra-casual AND low to middle-low income. My outfit are primarily casual, but they're a step up (or several steps up) from what I see around me. I sometimes worry that my somewhat dressier and more pulled-together casual looks could come across as a slap in the face.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

Cathy, that's a really good point, and I guess that's why I brought Day Vies' comment to its own thread. I think we struggle with our casual capsules because there's so much variation in what casual means in different environments, and also because when we're casual is also when we (may) want to appear "approachable," or to feel "extra comfortable" or even "effortless." And even if an outfit feels effortless to me, if I keep getting comments to the effect that I made an effort (or too much of an effort) it can become difficult to maintain that sense of savoir faire.

Most of us know that if we work in a conservative business environment, we have to conform to certain standards, at least in a broad way. And even if we work in a creative field, we want to (somehow) look the part. But the casual capsule can be so many things.

Rachylou, you had me laughing out loud for real with your hilarious and insightful comments. Nicole -- you, too. Canadians, indeed. Or Alaskans.

Beth Ann, I sometimes feel like you do. I don't really feel as if I "belong," sartorially, in my city. Fortunately, because I now work at home, it doesn't much matter.

Ironically, now that I'm working at home, wearing what I consider my most casual capsule, I now dress closer to the standard everyday dress in this city -- even of people who work outside the home! I feel as if I'm as dressed down as a person can be and still be decently covered. Yet if I go out to the supermarket or even out to lunch, I'll often be the most dressed up person in the room. What is "dressy"? Oh...maybe a knit jacket instead of a cardigan. Maybe a slight heel on my bootie instead of gear shoes.

I think Day Vies also implied another factor. Some of us, no matter what we wear -- even the fleece or whatever -- we will be perceived as dressed up. Hunh? In the same outfit but more dressed up than the person beside us? But it happens.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

Ariadne, yes - I think that is a common worry. I have felt it.

Deborah (Australian Deb) always dresses like herself (her very polished self) regardless. And told me that she has never received negative feedback. I suspect she is so inherently kind and ladylike that no one would take her lovely clothes as insulting to themselves. But I don't know if that is the case for everyone.

As an undergrad, I could never, ever find jeans that fit me right. So I defaulted to what (even then) struck me as very prim styles, mostly skirts. In a way, it made sense; I needed to look presentable for my retail jobs. The skirts were also (ironically) cheaper than the jeans. But I took a lot of flack, not just for being dressed up, but for seeming hoity-toity. People thought I was rich because of the way I dressed, when in fact, I was the one working to put myself through school.

Gaylene

Veteran

I think Rachylou nailed it with this statement: "...people will say, "a bit dressed up, eh?" This does not mean you are dressed up. This means you are not wearing the outfit above."

Every environment has its "outfit" (or dress code, if you want to use fancier language). If you don't dress in the "outfit", you stand out from the group. If you stand out from the group, members of the group try to guess your intentions. Are you saying you don't want to be part of the group? Are you trying to differentiate yourself from other people in the group (insert the "snobby" comment here)? Are you just an oddball?

The comment "a bit dressed up,eh?" is a subtle(?) attempt to try to bring you back into the group. If the group members are generally congenial, they often just develop an "Oh, that's just Martha--she always dresses like that" approach to your preferred style of dress. But other groups might flat out reject you, or more likely, roll their eyes at your name when you are not around. Which, if you aren't really wanting to be part of that group, probably isn't going to bother you much.

Personally, I think "casual" dress is the hardest one for many of us because it involves what we wear when we are with family and friends. Do I wear my cashmere hoody when I'm visiting my husband's family, or do I layer my fleece vest over my flannel shirt? In the rural community where his family have their farm, I know the answer if I want to be part of the group.

cciele

Veteran

Suz, you made an interesting observation:
"Some of us, no matter what we wear -- even the fleece or whatever -- we will be perceived as dressed up. "

Perhaps we can do a challenge, and all wear the same thing (e.g., jeans, t-shirt) and see if we can pinpoint what it is about an outfit, or the person wearing it, that makes that outfit more or less casual? Would that even work?

Isabel

Veteran

All.the.time. I have to say that I think what you do for a living plays a role. I am a stay at home mom, so when I show up for an afterschool basketball game, people expect you to roll in in jeans and sneakers and a polar fleece. Or a yoga outfit. Other women who work get more of a pass if they dress up according to their "position" ( it is a small town ).

Once, when my one of my friends visited me and we went out around town, someone I knew commented that my friend wasn't dressed very well for a VP position in a Fortune 500 company ( which she is ) . The funny thing was that my friend looked FAB in a navy eyelet dress that fit her to a T and she was wearing beautiful sandals. She is always well groomed, though her nails are never colored. I am not sure what the person expected, an Armani suit to walk around a very small, rural , farm town ? Humans are really interesting creatures, aren't we.

One more example..once when I was at our little grocery store, the woman at the cash register was talking to the man in front of me about another woman in town. The man said, " Have you seen the size of that engagement ring ? " Cashier " Yes, that has to be at least 5 cts. " Man, " Why in God's name would a stay at home mom wear something like that ? The most fancy thing she does is grocery shop ? " Hmmmmm......

Regarding the "who do you think you are", Stacy London once answered that with a quote from Elizabeth Taylor, " I am me. "

catgirl

Veteran

That'a a great idea, Cathy. Sort of like no matter what I wear, I seem to have a RATE aura. I don't think it's even possible for you to look ratty, Suz!

Anonymous

Joining Una on the RATErs. Even when I am dressed up, I still look RATE even when attempting polish! I think Angie and Suz and other fabbers like Joy, Claire, Deborah are ones with innate polish.

Suz

(website)

Veteran

That challenge would be super fun, Cathy!!

Una, I've been thinking...at first (thinking of Day Vies) I thought maybe it was the polished/ RATE distinction, i.e. the polished among us look inherently less casual, no matter what.

But I'm not sure that's true. You can be very RATE but not terribly casual sometimes.

catgirl

Veteran

Yes, I'm not saying they are equal (RATE/casual) but that some of us inherently project a certain vibe, be it RATE or polished or casual or dressy. Perhaps we should do a "dress your opposite" challenge again. Last time I did it I didn't own polished shoes!

rachylou

Veteran

cciele, I think that would be really interesting if we all put on jeans and a tee and see how it came out, on which side of the spectrum - casual or fancy.

Gaylene

Veteran

This is such an interesting thread, Suz.

Do you think that part of the problem comes from the way clothing and individuality is so closely associated these days? For centuries, what one wore was dictated by one's class, occupation, or circumstances. In the later part of the 20th century, the idea clothing as a type of "uniform" that signaled one's group, position, or occupation was completely overthrown by the idea of clothing as a form of personal expression and creativity. Instead of wanting to look like I belong, I now want to look like me.

The conflict comes when we hit the wall of societal expectations and group dress codes. Do I hang on to my individuality even if it means upsetting or irritating others, or do I adjust my outfit to fit the prevailing ideas about how a person ought to be dressed? And, maybe, "casual dress" is where this conflict becomes most noticeable for many of us...

Lyn D.

Veteran

Very interesting, Suz, and I think we are on the right track.
Deborah wearing her camo. jeans springs to mind. Still looks elegant and polished and true to style.
Perhaps it is that 'third element'- jacket/shoes or even hair/accessories that can set apart a casual ensemble.
Strange too, that although I am an introvert, I don't mind being the most 'dressed-up' person in a room.

Day Vies

Veteran

Suz you are a genius for starting this thread. I haven't yet been back to the original one to read those comments.

Rachylou -- YOU ARE A NUT --- omg, I was laughing out loud and choking on my food. You are so right and btw, in my neck of the woods that outfit is standard casual fair. If you ain't wearing it you're not part of the group.

I really appreciate the comments here because it seems to underscore the idea that there is something inherently bad about wanting to look attractive (highlight your own unique beauty) rather than blend in and look like everyone else.

Could "casual" under some circumstances mean "try to look like everyone else" or "don't you dare show up looking pretty". I felt like this was the case when I would hang out with some friends from college (we don't "hang" anymore though we're still friendly). I got the impression that they thought since I got married that being attractive would be a thing of the past for me.

Even when I'm casually dressed I still want to look pulled together-- it has nothing to do with being attractive to others. It's more about pleasing myself, being creative and enjoying my clothes. Some groups/communities act like this is some sort of crime.

catgirl

Veteran

Hmm, so far no one has said that they are the most casual person where they live. Does anyone live where casual is dressier? And what does that say about the culture in general?

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