Thanks Dana,

I will look for better coats & try to be more flexible with the rules. I find that hard. Unless I never knew them to begin with. Then I have a good sense on my own I think.

Thing is I was always comfortable with my shoulders & bust. The only body part I was ever concerned with was my tummy. Then I decided to go somewhat minimal in my living space, going paperless, scanning & shredding, purging from my entire small apartment so I could feel less cluttered.

I started with minimalist websites, which led to looking up how many clothes we really need etc. What I found was that we only wear 20% of our clothes 80% of the time & the best way to have fewer clothes is to have ones that really work for me & that really work together. That is where I got into doing the style & bodytype research & now I'm so flustered at what was supposed to simplify my life because what I'm finding is that I have a lot more areas to be worried about & disguise or balance out. Not to mention that even though 40 is the new 30, in looks & spirit, even 30 year olds shouldn't wear what I wear sometimes.

I still believe if I stick with it it will simplify my life in the future but I think your suggestion to ease up on the rules is a good one. It's hard once you know them. I always break the rule of black not being as good for an Autumn as brown because black is easier to find & to wear with other colors & with itself.

Welcome to the forum, Elle! I can relate to your post because I also had a difficult time figuring out my shape, and analyzed it to death. I eventually concluded I am a little of this and a little of that... and you and I both share some similarities.

I think this is one of those situations where knowing your actual measurements may be helpful? For example, you say you wear a 32 bra band. What is the measurement at the widest part of your hip? If it is greater than 32 or 33, then you are indeed leaning more towards a pear. (Cup size makes no difference). I'm curious to know!

Likewise, you mentioned waist measurements: The "7" isn't inches: it's the ratio between your waist and your hip measurement. If 0.7 or less, then you are definitely in pear or hourglass territory -- and personally I'd be hard pressed to put you in apple category. If you are 0.8 or greater, then we are talking rectangle, apple, possibly IT.

To my eyeball I agree with the gals who say you have a lovely defined waist. I also lean towards hourglass for your shape. But I'm still curious to know your exact measurements. As for your legs, they do NOT look short to me. They look perfectly proportional. I get frustrated because we're all immersed in pictures of tall models with endlessly long legs. It's easy to assume our legs are short, when they may be perfectly proportioned. I was told forever I had short legs but according to golden ratio, they are perfectly proportioned for my height. (I still like adding a few inches with heels anyway!)

For comparison, as I am 47, I eventually decided I am an IT with apple tendencies. I decided this because like you I have straight shoulders, and visually they are definitely wider than my hips. With clothes often it is the shoulders that may not quite fit -- if I size up it's baggy elsewhere. If it fits the rest of me, my shoulders are just a tad tight. However my chest and hips are exactly the same measurement -- 33 inches. ETA: another IT tell-tale sign, for me, is that very often when suit shopping I need a size 4 jacket -- to fit the shoulders -- but only a size 2 skirt or pants. If that's not IT, I don't know what is!

I wear a 34 bra band only because the 32 bra band tends to be too tight and I don't have the patience to wear it enough to loosen it up. (I wish they made a 33 bra band!). Cup size is B, sometimes C, depends on the bra. I have been told I'm busty and I suppose I do look busty -- but I think that is because I'm only 5'. Proportion is everything!

My thighs are scrawny and I have skinny legs, which points more towards IT shape as well. I do not have much meat on my butt either. Even if hips are same width as chest, visually, my legs/butt add to the illusion that I'm more of an upside down triangle. There's just more "meat" overall on my upper body (arms, back, no defined shoulder bones).

My waist is 0.8 ratio: it varies a lot, and is the first place I gain. This makes muffin top an issue all the time. I feel your frustration on that! I also have the "momma's apron" below the waist -- from two pregnancies. Even if I am super fit with very low body fat percentage, there's that excess skin, which gives me a tummy and makes fitting pants and skirts a challenge. Posture DOES help... but only so much. That said, I've made peace with the tummy because it's my mother's badge of honor. And I've learned how to hide it. Or not hide it and just be confident.

So with all that going on, I take the guidelines with a grain of salt, and adopt here and there to create whatever shape I feel like achieving that day. That's the positive with a shape like ours that is "a bit of this and a bit of that." You can easily play up the hourglass shape. You could pull of IT fashions with ease. You could decide one day to dress totally pear like. You can have a lot of fun!

Hi Shiny,

Thanks. I too feel I am a little of this & a little of that. I slim or average legs & butt & though my waist is defined it is not much smaller than bust & hip so I don't feel as curvy as an hourglass.

My bust is 37 1/2", waist 30" & hip 37" but my bust size is due to fullness at the front. If you look at the pictures of me front on my bust is narrower than hip. I bought a program that doesn't account for shoulders.

If you account for my shoulders they are slightly wider than hip. Visually though my hip, shoulders & bust are similar. If you were to be very precise from the front my shoulders are the widest point or my hips if you ignore shoulders as My Private Stylist program does.

Here are pics with lines drawn by MPS.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1pnr.....age007.jpg

https://www.dropbox.com/s/kun1.....nt%202.jpg

Ok so I am .81 so now I have Angie's definition saying I am an hourglass, My Private Stylist a triangle (which is pear) & the ratio method a rectangle or IT.

Hmm. Something is off here. I can see why the lines are drawn that way, but if your actual measurements are 37.5" chest and 37" hips, then the line should go straight down, no? Either you are measuring your chest wrong, or it's some error/trick/illusion with the photo.

Can you have someone measure your chest for you? Often if you do it yourself, it can be easy to measure incorrectly -- maybe the tape measurement isn't completely horizontal to the ground.

If your hips are 37 and waist is 30 (that's at the most narrow part, right?) then your ratio is 0.8. Actually your ratio is exactly identical to my own (27W-33H).

Visually, your waist does look tinier than mine -- I'd have bet on it. I think it's because you have a longer hip than I do.

I think we may be shape twins! Except I'm a lot shorter than you!

... and be sure that your tape measure isn't cloth. Cloth measures stretch out and then give inaccurate measurements!

Elle, I've been reading your thread with interest because I'm definitely a long-waisted IT with short legs. And I agree with all the ladies who have said to take the "dressing for your shape" theory with a HUGE grain of salt. The same goes for what constitutes a "minimalist" wardrobe for you.

Personally, I like my broad shoulders and have absolutely no desire to camouflage them. I like the way they cause my clothes to hang straight from my shoulder line. I will admit that spaghetti straps and puffed sleeves look ridiculous on me, but I've always worn epaulets on my jackets and other forms of shoulder emphasis with pleasure.

I also like having relatively slim hips, so I often choose to emphasize that portion of my body with slim-cut pants and skirts instead of "balancing my lower half" as most IT recommendations suggest. The only areas that I chose to watch more closely are belted garments and outfits that shorten my leg line. But even in these areas, using Angie's tips have helped me find ways to wear these styles in ways that I find flattering.

And I think that the consensus on this forum is that your wardrobe is the right size if you wear all the items. If you don't wear certain items, it's instructive to think of WHY you don't choose them before tossing them out and trying to replace them. And, for items that you do wear, again, trying to figure out WHAT commonalities they have gives you a better insight into your personal style and lifestyle preferences. That is the best way to start overhauling your wardrobe. Blindly following someone else's recommendations as to what you ought to wear when you are 30, or 40, or 50-- or what pieces are essential for a minimalist wardrobe-- rarely work for anyone.

So, I guess, what I'm saying is ultimately YOU need to decide how you want to dress your body. If you have questions, posting pictures here will give you lots of feedback-- and you'll also discover that different people have quite different opinions. The glorious thing about developing a personal style is that you will NOT want to look like everyone else!

Sorry I keep posting on your thread. I wanted to add that my youngest daughter and I have somewhat similar proportions /shapes -- except she is 4 inches taller than me, has a DD cup!!, and swimmer's shoulders (which I'd probably also have if I ever took up competitive swimming). Because of her super strong, muscular shoulders and back and bustiness, she does have an appearance of an IT -- even though the rest of her proportions put her firmly in hourglass territory: 34-23-34.

When I compare myself to her, I have a hard time calling myself an hourglass. Because her waist is teeny-tiny!!!!!!

There once was a time, before kids, when I rocked a 23 inch waist too, just like she does. That time is never coming back -- pregnancy stretched me out permanently and no dieting in the world will solve it.

Shiny post as much as you like it all helps:) My bust measures bigger because fullness goes out to the front not the sides.

Gaylene thanks for the common sense:)

You should measure above your breasts -- don't include your breasts in the measurement? Or maybe I'm wrong?

Okay I just went and did this myself... right beneath my breasts, I measure 29 inches. Over my breasts (without bra) I'm 35 inches. Above the breasts I'm 33.

hmm.... now I'm confused!

Sorry Shiny. Now my confusion is contagious lol. I checked out the way to measure on chicfashionista.com & there I am a rectangle due to not a very large waist to hip ratio but bust & hip being almost the same.

Thing is, if you flip those lines they drew on your photo upside down, I bet they'd line up with your upper half. Which would mean hourglass -- despite your waist/hip ratio.

I never really analyzed it this way but now you've got me looking at my own shape, in the chest area... it goes from 29 to 33... (ignoring cup size)... and then add in the shoulders .... upside down triangle formation from waist to chest to armpits and then to shoulders.

Can you see what I mean?

Yeah... I think you and I just have a "bit of this/bit of that" shape... we could be considered any of the shapes, depending on how you want to draw the lines.

... and now I'm looking at a "How to measure bra size" site and have just realized why it's possible I can wear either a 34 B (but not a 34 C-- cups too big), OR a 32 DD.... (but not a 32 C, cups way too small)... it all depends on whether you go with the under-bra measurement (29) or the above bra measurement (33).

Hi Shiny I don't see pics of you but I think the main difference between all of my sources is what is included in the measuring/decision process. My Private Stylist doesn't include shoulders & it goes by what you look like 2 dimensionally not your measurements because people see you that way. So if your breast is narrower looking front on in a mirror than hip you are a triangle as they call it or a pear as we call it.

If you include shoulders as we do here then you could be an hourglass if shoulders match the hip & bust I think or an IT if shoulders are wider than bust & hip.

On chicfashionista I would be an hourglass I think because they include shoulders but they require a larger difference between waist & hip so therefore I am a rectangle. They say to use a measuring tape as well as a mirror.

If I include shoulders then I am a slight hourglass or slight rectangle or slight IT but not a pear. If I exclude shoulders I am a slight pear. I am not extremely anything except for my protruding tummy that can turn into a muffin top with anything that isn't a dress.

So I guess cup size doesn't come into bodytype but how it looks front on in proportion to the rest of your body.

I brought up cup size in earlier posts because the program I bought had additional considerations & clothing exclusions they give to everyone with a large cup size, regardless of bodytype.

OK, this measurement thing is fascinating, but I'm having a hard time seeing how it's helpful? It seems to be that you'd need a full body scan that would take into account things like breast shape (fullness in the upper or lower area) and position, hip shape (high or low), waist position relative to hip and bust, leg proportion and thickness, butt shape,-- and a couple of hundred other measurements in order to accurately assess a body shape. And, at the end, the point would be to slot yourself into 4 or 5 general categories that may, or may not, be useful?

Sorry, I just don't get it.

Sorry Gaylene. I think I'm confusing or stressing everyone now. I guess it's more about how we look than what we measure. If I look in the mirror my shoulder is widest, followed, by hips, followed by bust but all look very similar. If one includes shoulders or not makes the biggest difference I think.

Now you've got me giggling at the thought of what I'd look like without shoulders. How would I carry my cross-body bag? Most of us look better with shoulders, so I'd consider keeping them, LOL

Seriously, Elle, I don't think you're confusing or stressing out anyone here. Most of us have gone through what you are going through; the sheer amount of information that is out there attempting to tell us how we ought to dress is pretty overwhelming. But, I think, with Angie's help, most of us on this forum have come to realize that much of what we were told was not very helpful.

I like Angie's approach much better. She offers ideas, suggestions, commentaries, and photos to help us discover our own guidelines. And part of the fun in this forum is seeing how many of us end up changing our minds about "dos and don'ts" with a little experimentation and encouragement. After spending a couple of years on this site, I wear things that I never dreamed possible for my body and age. So much more fun than being forced into a pre-detemined set of "rules".

Gaylene, that's funny. When you put it that way perhaps I should include my shoulders in overall body type. I wonder if I can get a refund from the program I bought.

LOL... it is confusing because it IS confusing-- for those of us who aren't one of the 4 or 5 distinct and obvious types, but a mish-mash of several types. (The only thing I know for sure is I'm NOT a pear).

Elle, I have decided we are "Proportionate" types and that is that. What do you think? We are proportionately a little of everything.

The guidelines do help: just start with your least favorite aspect, what you want to play down. Go by your gut. It sounds like apple would be best place to start? But read through all the guidelines and adopt as needed to create the shape you want, on an outfit-by-outfit basis.

Elle, I grew up with pretty pears as my main role models (my big sister and my mom) so forever I thought that was the "IDEAL" type... and it depressed me and gave me some severe body image issues, because that's the type I'm farthest away from. But I did learn how to create that shape when I feel like it.

Thanks Shiny:) You & Gaylene & some others whose name retrieval would involve a lot of backtracking have given some sound advice.

Before going online for answers I used to look in the mirror to see if something looked bad or good or wrong or off. Now I think instead of getting too attached to bodytype suggestions I will continue to use my eye & then if I can't put my finger on what looks wrong I can post pics on YLF for advice.

Hi, Elle;
Looking at the various photos you've posted, I'm wondering if you have any consistent fit challenges? You look very balanced, so maybe that is the source of your labeling confusion. It may be that you can wear a multitude of styles! Of course, some stores and some brands skew toward particular body types (straighter/curvier/bigger hips), and it seems that most women beyond Angelina Jolie show some type of muffin if they wear low cut pants and the like.

Hi Donna,

I have a lot of fit issues. Shopping is difficult for me. I have a long waist so clothes with a defined waist land in the wrong place, above my natural waist.

Many button down shirts gape at bust unless they are too big elsewhere. Others are too tight on tummy unless they are too big for the waist but maybe they are meant to be a looser boxier style.

If I buy pants or skirts to fit my waist whether it lands on natural waist or lower, which is often the case with pants & jeans, they end up too baggy on hips, butt & thighs.

This is across many brands of clothing.

A fascinating thread.

I know where you are coming from. I once posted a thread along the lines of " I am a pear/hourglass/IT/rectangle/apple!!

I am also long waisted and frequently find waistbands that are not long enough and wrap around my rib cage. No real advice there

I think one of your figure flattery priorities should be making the most of your waist from the sides while hiding the tummy from the front. A great look for that is a fitted top that has a drapy section in the middle (cciele posted a good example of one today). Another tip which I learnt from Shiny, is too wear a flowy blouse with a fitted jacket or cardigan over the top. The sides are accentuated, the tummy is disguised. Give them a try!!

Thanks Anne! Great advice:)