So invite her out to lunch at the mall, fillowed by a browsing session—lots of pix, no intent to buy. Some Queen Mum, some Laverne—but look at what *she* sees in each thing. You might see “tight” where she sees “highlighting waist” or “keeping my boobs in” or “long legs” or whatever. There’s more than one way to skin a cat, but you’ve got to ….know the cat she’s trying to skin. Weird metaphor, but I agree with Jules on paying attention to recurring details and themes in what she sends you, instead of tossing it all in one great big undifferentiated “bad taste” bucket—but I already said that with those links. Finding out her flattery priorities would be a big help. Does she like big hair qua big hair, or does she want to balance out something else? You’re the shrink, but the deb pix sound to me like she knows she needs to settle down, but doesn’t know how to, without giving up altogether

April, how does your friend dress on a daily basis? It seems to me that might play into what she’s attracted to? If she always dresses in a Cher/Laverne way, I don’t know if your (good) taste will sway what she’s attracted to.

I know people like this and I know people on the plain, even dumpy end of the spectrum. Their MOG or MOB dresses (and hairstyles that day, etc.) pretty much reflect their fashion personas, albeit slightly elevated. And that makes them feel comfortable on a stressful day. (Yes, the day is happy but also stressful.)

I saw wedding photos of a friend’s relative’s wedding in Bermuda. Everyone was dressed preppy/classic/tasteful EXCEPT the MOG, who was dressed as if she was going to a nightclub in Vegas. And that apparently is her personality and she wasn’t willing to fade into the woodwork for her son’s wedding. What can you do?

I’m with Jules and would suggest she look at it the way we dress for a job interview, a funeral, painting the house - there are certain uniforms or norms that make it less about revealing who we are 100% and more about fitting in and getting the job done. Certain colours and patterns look better in photos than others, as do certain styles. Couch your advice in such a way that her outfit compliments what is going on with the bride and wedding party, as well as the venue and less about who she is in that moment.

Just chiming in to say I dig "Laverne" style dressing. One of my style muses is the 75 year old Lilli Bendriss. She dresses like this all the time, though.

Well, at age 70 if procrastination is an issue that’s unlikely to change. And it seems unclear whether she actually wants ‘help’ in the form of advice or just a sounding board and attention. Either way you're not responsible for her choice in the end. That said I think my own advice at this point would be to be a bit blunter’… ‘looks a little showgirl to me’… ‘not sure that’s appropriate to the event/venue’… or even ‘very you but maybe not for your son’s wedding!’. She did after all ask for your input - and if turns out she doesn’t like it she can stop sending pictures and you’re off the hook.

Synne, wow, she is awesome! Knows what she wants and what looks good on her, is old & wise enough not to give a fig what others say. I looked her up on IG--she's cool.

I was going to also suggest a nice lunch together, maybe with wine then a shopping session...pre-arranged personal shopper maybe to take the heat off you? To me it sounds like she might want a friend more than the perfect outfit...? But Nordstrom's or other high end department stores must deal with this kind of MOB, MOG situation all the time. Let the sales assistants do the hard part, while you hold her hand.

@ judy - you are brilliant!

I have found this thread very thought provoking on a whole lot of fronts. In terms of action here April, I like the idea of an in store stylist if that is possible.

And agree that support may be what she needs more than fashion advice.

It’s a hard one with friends and advice - I have got it right and got it wrong! Sometimes being frank and direct is effective- other times listening and commiseration is a better approach.

All the best for whatever approach you use.

It genuinely makes me sad to think of a mother of a bride or groom choosing her dress by ordering random things off the internet and trying them on at home. Making the search into An Event, with scheduled appointments and the like, eases the inevitable stress. The stylists and sales assistants generally make it an occasion and pull out all the stops, including wine. . The experienced ones know which makers and styles are best for which bodies and they make sure you see everything they have that is suitable. They know if something can be ordered in other colors and how long that might take. There is a tailor available who can assess what alterations are feasible.

I never would have chosen either of my MOB dresses based on a picture. And the second one I didn’t even want to try when I saw it on the hanger. Neither dress was what I thought I was looking for — and both were perfect.

I hope by the August there would be more options in the stores because right now I'm still answering the same question "That's all you have in dresses?" - "Yes, and it's pretty much the same in Macy's and Nordstrom ". We get new things every week ( mostly on Fridays ) and dresses are selling fast.
That wonderful experience with a client specialist with wine, catalogs, knowledge of the same dress in different colors ( or with sleeves ) is probably not achievable in current year.
I second the idea of lunch and easy shopping/looking at things with some SA help.
Getting seamstress consultation is essential - in my recent situation the young bride to be has asked classic black dress to be shortened to mini length, tightened in the hips/hem and was beaming with true happiness after all those things were done ( off-the-shoulder ruffled dress by Aidan Mattox ). She looked stunning.

Update: yesterday I sent two dress ideas. One is not available until after the wedding, so that one was out. But this one https://www.neimanmarcus.com/p.....ldItemId=N was met with love. There is a Neiman Marcus near Friend so she could go and try it on IRL, as she prefers.

Whew. I'm not exactly knocking it out of the park, but I at least made one suggestion that might be viable.

Ryce -- that's interesting. For me, it's the opposite* but I suspect you and Friend are on the same page.

*I mean that when I'm feeling insecure about trying things on, I prefer to be in the privacy of my own closet, with my own wardrobe of undergarments/accessories available to me.

Thank you all again for hanging in there with me!

Nice!
Think she might like any of these too, so she has a couple to choose from at the last minute, according to mood?
https://www.nordstrom.com/s/pi.....origin=cat

https://www.neimanmarcus.com/e.....at=product

https://www.nordstrom.com/s/ta.....dinating-5

https://www.neimanmarcus.com/e.....d243200039?

I love the Etro Silk Hankerchief dress!

Big yes to Judy's suggestion! It's really something that should be done in person to try a lot of styles at once.

This from Ryce struck me as so true:

“I never would have chosen either of my MOB dresses based on a picture. And the second one I didn’t even want to try when I saw it on the hanger. Neither dress was what I thought I was looking for — and both were perfect.”

I think I told the story here a couple of years ago about my sister’s MOB crisis when my niece got married in London. My sister’s luggage, complete with MOB ensemble and clothes for the whole trip, never made it to London, and the airlines could make no promises. So when I arrived a day later, my sister was beside herself. Her first time flying anywhere overseas and this happens, much less for her daughter’s wedding! Well, I hustled her with me to Marks & Spencer, and I was on such a mission, I simply caught the first employee I found and explained what we needed. Smart lady, she ran and found a wonderful sales assistant who told us to go have a seat and some water in the fitting room lounge, got my sister’s sizes and color preferences, and proceeded to bring her multiple options, including shoes and accessories, even a fascinator!

The dresses were not what my sister would have chosen, but afterward she expressed that she loved what she wore so much more than the outfit she had planned to wear. Shopping with her for that occasion was a truly memorable exercise in taking a challenge and making it an opportunity — and a fun one at that! It was also a good exercise in relinquishing some control and letting others help us, which is something my sister and I both have trouble doing, LOL.

I share this story because I think the experience could be a great bonding one for nice memories if it’s explored with a mindset of being open and trying things, rather than big expectations. Good luck!

Much love for that story, Janet.

So far, the accounts I've heard of Friend's (multiple) shopping trips have all ended in fitting room tears, declarations that "I'll lose ten pounds then try again," and vows to "take a week off from looking."

I would guess this is because she's not using a good SA and is picking things to try on that don't emphasize what she wants to emphasize.

Also suspect that if she told the SA "casual elegance", the SA would suggest items similar to what I've been suggesting.

Just chiming in to say what a good and sensitive friend you are being.
And that I really like the suggestions to get friend moving on from online browsing/ musing, which could go on forever, to actual tryons, and best w/ neutral party but wouldn’t rule out y’all going together.

Not wanting to hijack, but this post really resonates with me not just on my MOB dress experience, but with my evolving roles, goals, body shape, style preferences and how a lot of things I thought I liked or were “ me” don’t always look how I want when trying on or trialing and outfit IRL, and things “ on the hanger “ that I might have rejected may have a great vibe I never anticipated.

I love the Flower Girl reference and can think of how it extends to many other situations of how one may be going for a certain look- and actually be able to know it when you see it— but continually barking up the wrong garment style-tree to get there, and needing some way to get that epiphany of “ oh now THIS is what gets me THERE- I never knew”.

I love @Janet’s story. I remember it from before! And @April you are such a dear friend!

That Neiman’s is pretty darn fantastic. It’s so hard when you have to find something. Anything in a world of stuff is easy; one thing in a world full of stuff is torture!

But rubber meets to road at the tryon.

ps: I remember that Janet! A great ‘moral’ tale!

April, you really are a good friend. You listened, but you also read the visuals and you came up with a dress that is sophisticated in a maximal way.

I am so impressed, it would be a great end to the chapter if this is the one.

Thanks, Runcarla !

That's a brilliant story, Janet.

April, you're a good friend. All the best in this adventure!

April, I think she really does need a psychologist more than a fashion stylist. What if you really engaged the question of "who do I want to be?" I bet once that question is answered, it will be a lot easier to pick a dress. (And if it's "myself at 25," maybe bringing it to the surface will make it clear that's not an option, so she can more to a more realistic idea.)

And also? You are a saint for doing this!

LOL, MM. Friend has, in fact, told me about a hundred times that she wants me to suggest a good therapist.

Does she want me to suggest a good therapist? Hell no - she wants praise for thinking it might be a good idea. Which I have provided, each and every time, followed by, "Let me know when you're ready to schedule your first appointment."

Ahh...this has been such an interesting and instructive thread.

I found myself nodding along with so many of these responses.

You're a good friend, April.

And that's part of what this is about, too, right? How can we be good friends to those friends who both beg for and then resist our efforts to help?

I have a friend like this, too, and I continually struggle with how to respond. It's not about fashion choices in that case, but the pattern is similar. My friend is not happy with herself, cannot allow herself to be satisfied or happy with herself. And that is the core problem -- one I can't solve. I can only let her know that I care for her. But sometimes, to be honest, I get intensely irritated and I have to set personal boundaries with her.

I have a person like this in my life. I have learned she doesn’t really want a solution to problems, but instead simply wants validation and someone to listen to her and commiserate. It used to drive me batty (well, still does on occasion) but it’s better for my own mental health to simply nod along. It’s hard when you are a fixer or problem-solver, however!

To Suz and Aquamarine's points about friends, a story came to mind.

I was on the phone with a friend. This was probably 20 years ago or so. In this case, it was me doing the sharing about a problem I was having. She kindly and caringly responded : "Wow, what are you going to do??" This stunned me at the time. In that instant I realized a few things. One, that I was looking for commiseration because I felt so helpless. And two, I realized that she did not see me as helpless. In fact, she fully expected that I WAS going to do something. And this really helped me in that moment.

Since then I have remembered that in a few situations with others and I've been the one to ask them what are they going to do. It's so easy to start trying to fix, to help, to give advice, to in some way take on another's issues. And often, inevitably the help is resisted. When I have remembered that question, it has actually worked remarkably well in that the one sharing seems to shift to a solution based mindset, that they are the initiators of. And I notice they leave the conversation feeling better. As do I ! I just don't always remember to do it :).

Judy, thanks for sharing that story. Excellent point.

Judy, great story and great reminder. I will try to put it into action with my friend the next time the problem arises (because I know it will.....)