Lets talk: "The Life-Changing Magic of Tidying Up: The Japanese art of decluttering and organiz - YouLookFab Forum

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Lets talk: "The Life-Changing Magic of Tidying Up: The Japanese art of decluttering and organiz

frannieb

Veteran

So I jumped into the rabbit hole and bought the book.
First - it makes a ton of sense and I have spent the weekend refolding all my clothes - which I love - now I have tons of space in my dresser drawer and I will be able to get rid of one I have wanted out of my room for a long time.

The reason I spent all weekend refolding my close is because thanks to YLF - I did this for my sweaters as the beginning of the season. somewhere on here I saw rolling sweaters and keeping in a drawer. It is one of the best things I ever did - I wear more of my sweaters they stay crisp instead of wrinkled and I put them away right away because they are so organized.

My disagreement - she suggests keeping all your clothes visible instead of sorted by season. I have personally found the visual clutter from my out of season clothes overwhelms me. Storing my summer dresses and tanks in the middle of winter actually increases my joy of them and my winter clothes because they have room to been seen and breathe. Plus I really don't want to see wool after April or before November.

My questions for those of you who have done this:
What do you do about truly utilitarian clothes - I personally am not a fan of tennis shoes at all - but I need to have them for working out. Working out brings me joy - tennis shoes do not. Same with workout clothes - they just serve a purpose no real joy in them.
Or what about the skirt with a print I love love love, the cut of the skirt is wrong and it is a little too small - it does bring me joy - but really I won't wear it - does this go.
I think this may be too much of my western mind trying to make sense with eastern thought.

What I will change:
I am folding more things instead of hanging. All my ponte pants and skirts are now neatly folded and in a drawers as little packages. I actually like them more this way.

What I will try:
Next week I am going to start with the big clothing purge - I have already done a fairly big one - but now that I know my style words and paid attention to what I really wear - I'm ready for purge part 2. and ready to let go of some of the guilt. On my journey to find my professional style the last 4 years I have made some mistakes and just need to thank those mistakes for what they taught me and move on without the guilt.

This is really probably way too much thought about organizing clothes - but the book made me realize some of this may be the missing link to a truly functional wardrobe.

General

50 replies

Latest reply was from Mary Beth (formerly LBD)

lyn67

Veteran

I know folding tanks on edge all visible in a drawer from Mo...rolling sweaters, probably a good ideea, too-thus cannot imagine how they are not wrinkled more than folded the classic old fashion way. We need picties, to see that closet nirvana:-)).

karymk

Veteran

I read the article on her in New York Magazine and am piqued. So yesterday I removed all the clothing from my closet and got out a big rolling rack. I assessed everything and even though I toss regularly, still had more to toss or give away. Mostly due to ridiculous duplication! But this major exercise made me see my style and my clothes more clearly. Whether or not I can keep my things folded neatly remains a question. Today I will take an inventory of all items and do a count of how many things are in each category.

I like her principals, but I can do this thing on my own.

Summer

Veteran

I haven't read the book, but have seen snippets here and there.

I agree, though that rolling sweaters (and tees) keeps them in easy view, tidy and wrinkle free. I also agree with you about storing out of season clothes. It seems to make sense to have it out of the way when it's not being worn.

To answer your question about utilitarian clothes; could you devote a separate drawer or two to these so they would be ready to hand but out of sight? And, maybe, the tennis shoes could be stored in an attractive shoe bag?

Jennifer

I bought and read this book too and am so glad someone started a thread on it! I loved the book. The only thing that is stopping me from doing a massive overhaul of my entire house is the fact that I have a one-year-old and my time is at a premium, or even, shall we say, closely choreographed. But I have started with my clothes, like you.
I love the concept of rolling clothes and have implemented it myself. I find it actually gives me great pleasure to be able to see everything at a glance when I open a drawer. It is taking me some time to purge as completely as I should, and it helps that when I open a drawer, occasionally I see something that makes me think, "do I really love this"? If I find myself asking that, it usually means I don't, and out it goes. I am finding a great deal of satisfaction in this.
I think the skirt has to go. Even if you love it, what is the use of keeping it if you can't wear it? Either get it tailored to fit (which it sounds like you can't, as it is too small), or give it to someone who will appreciate it. It has fulfilled its role in your life. Say thank you and move on. (Yes, I am being harsh but I am doing the same thing to myself and I know it is the right thing!)
Right now I still have too many clothes to keep them all in my closet/dresser - but once I whittle things down to where they should be, I fully intend to keep everything out and not have any out-of-season storage. Where I live, the climate really doesn't change that much for most of the year (temperate and rainy nine months of the year, hah!) so I wear things like wool sweaters most of the year anyway.
Re utilitarian clothes, I take the view that the clothes have a role in bringing me joy, so they are important. My workout clothes are in the bottom drawer of my dresser. I don't have to look at them all the time, but they are important and there when I need them. However, I am starting to think that maybe I should get myself some workout clothes that spark joy in themselves! Then they would have a dual role.
I love Marie Kondo's approach - just wish I could implement it more quickly myself! As it is, it might take me years to get there....

psychedelicate

(website)

Can you do something else with the fabric? (A pillow, whatever.) Will you actually do it? Throw it away and move on if not.
Re: storing out of season clothes--I kind of agree with her. I have tried doing it, and like her, I just don't get my in-season clothes out in time. If you have a very well-curated wardrobe, the space might not be an issue and you can rotate things in your dresser/closet so that the in-season stuff is in front.

frannieb

Veteran

Glad to see others are being inspired by the concept as much as I was. Today I have the day off and just using the statement do you love it had me ditch 4 t- shirts from my t- shirt pile. I also have about 7 sentimental t- shits I will never wear but I'm going to get a quilt made . Already found someone in town who can do this.

Helena

Veteran

Oh, this sounds right up my alley ... searching for the article ...

Ruth M

frannieb, you've probably thought of this already, but since you're already planning to have a quilt made up, can you possibly incorporate a section of fabric from the skirt whose print you love?

Marilyn

Veteran

My capsule of workout clothes is in a plastic under the bed box. On gym days I just slide it out, grab my outfit, and back under it goes. I leave my gym shoes in my gym bag.

Susie

Veteran

I prefer to have as many things as possible hanging rather than folded. So I have few things in drawers- just underwear, socks, pajamas, scarves and bathing suits. Of these, only the scarves are rolled. And I agree about out of season things. There are lots of things that can work year round, but I don't wear shorts in the winter or wool in July and I prefer to keep out of season stuff in another closet. The things that I will be pulling out for spring will feel way more fresh than if I had been seeing them in my main closet, unworn for 6 months.

I think you can let go of the skirt unless alterations can make it fit you. And of course keeping gear is fine....the joy you get from it comes from its usefulness.

unfrumped

Veteran

I liked it a lot more than I thought I would. I had to get past the fac that she's obsessed, to put it mildly, and that I don't have to be into the anthropomorphizing thing.

What resonated was doing a whole category at once. i find that hard to do, which is why I think she's onto something. I always did the drawer, the room , the 10 things a day, that sort of thing and it's really easy to just churn.
So it's more like some YLF approaches of going through ALL clothes at one time to see everything in comparison (the joy concept can be independent of it, but I feel that it helps the concept, if you have everything out you can see a pattern and wonder why you keep this when you have that.)
So for books then, I would get an idea not of the favorite books for one room or one bookshelf but my total collection.

I haven't had the time needed to do the system, but I'm thinking the actual weirdness of say, dumping all your whatsits from every room in the house, out together on a blanket on the floor, is a somewhat different approach that could lead to different results even thought it sounds overwhelming at first.

The related key concept I think that she is proposing is that if you only nibble away, you never get to the aha feeling of space and decluttering enough to feel really differentlly yourself, and so don't break out of the cycle. I can see that potential breakthrough from just neat-nicking to making some bigger change.

trekkiegirl

Veteran

Kind of a read and run (will be back later, just taking a short break from folding laundry...) if you love the print of the skirt so much, could you perhaps turn it into a scarf? No point in keeping something you will never wear, but I understand not wanting to part with it for such a specific reason.

tulle

Veteran

The book sounds intriguing. I'm always willing to try a better system! I agree with you about the seasonal changes. I love taking out the stored clothes at the beginning of each season, and have gotten into the habit of buying a few things at the end of Summer to pack away unworn so I'll have some new things to wear when we go to Florida in late Winter--it's always such a pleasant surprise. About that printed skirt: I completely understand your attachment to the fabric. Can you cut 2 squares out of it, each about 21" square? You could make a throw pillow cover. Even one good-sized square, backed with solid fabric, would do.

CocoLion

(website)

Veteran

I have rolled underwear and camisoles since the 1980s, I always thought of that as my own clever discovery. LOL.

But never thought to roll erstwhile folded things like tee shirts, sweaters and jeans! Where have I been?! Off to roll them…

Olivegreen

I liked the book. Have done the clothes category and it did lend a feeling of great calm to the closet. Bring joy, or on to the next person. Since I had an abundance of thrifted personae, pretty easy to do.
I do find that utilitarian is in my style descriptor, so I am as enamoured of sport gear and technical clothes as of my finer things, and frequently mix them up. So they stay in the front of the closet. The sport uniforms, underwear, and associated gear has a separate shelf, and are the most costly clothing I own. It all has its own nice bag and shelf.
I do not have any drawers, so it is all hanging or folded into vertical shelves. Scarves, folded or rolled, are still a problem
The joy part has altered my buying habits, and is changing my color palette to a brighter place. Interesting!
And did the kitchen. So very much better. The last to go is the dreaded craft room. Still not courageous enough for that.

Anonymous

Most of what I wear is hanging in my closet, and that's the way I like it. This business of folding or rolling would be good for those with limited closet space, though.

judy

Veteran

Reading this yesterday piqued my interest as well and just bought the book. Thanks for posting about it!

Vildy

Veteran

I haven't read the book yet but have read excerpts and numerous articles and seen videos plus I've skimmed several 1000 post mumsnet threads of people following through with this.

Right now, I'm on a long shopping break because I had the realization - from some blogpost I read - that these *are* my clothes. And I was too involved in constantly experimenting and tweaking, adding and editing. And it was all good and fine but it made my wardrobe seem temporary. Though still editing as needs be.

Anyway, I just read a Q and A session with her over on reddit, maybe.
Couple of things interested me personally. I don't relate well to "sparks joy" and I liked her alternate suggestion "item you are happy to have with you."

And this:
"Q: What if I don't love most the clothes in my closet? Should I get rid of all
of them and go spend money buying new ones?

A: [–]MarieKondo[S] 17 days ago

You should calm down a little bit. You do not want to be that extreme.
You should try to be more realistic and try to think about what you can do
to use the current items you already have, and add different items to those
to realize the other style that sparks joy to you."

This doesn't seem all that different from advice from Angie.

Also, she has recently been in U.S. and one thing she is looking at is the kind of questions she gets from different countries. She wants to see where she could tweak her method where need be. For example, in Japan, spaces are small and limited but in many countries there are homes with lots of room.

Staysfit

Veteran

I'm still stuck on my books. If anyone has a good suggestion on how to get past that block please let me know! Otherwise I was able to follow through with everything she recommended and have maintained with no difficulty.

shedev

Veteran

Yesterday I was reading some reviews on the book, and I came across a really funny one. Hedev wanted to know what I was laughing at. When I told him, he tried to hide in case I decided he doesn't spark joy. Then he opened a drawer and threw the roll of little baggies for when we walk the dogs and asked if they spark joy. We need a lot of things that aren't going to excite us.

I'm still looking forward to giving it a go. I bought the book for kindle and read a lot of it last night. I think it will be more useful for catagories of things that I haven't gone though a lot more than clothing, although I'm sure I'll shed some clothing. I'm still going to hang most of my clothes.

Jennifer

Staysfit: I have to admit I haven't tackled my books yet, because I am an avid book collector and the thought of getting rid of books strikes dread into my very soul. But I'm sure that even I can get rid of one shelf's worth, and that is going to be my initial goal with books. I think my criteria for books is going to be: Did I like this book enough to want to read it again? This is somewhat lower than my standards for keeping items in my closet, but as far as books are concerned, it's a reasonable position for me right now. Who knows, I might end up being able to go further than I expect...

Vildy

Veteran

Generally, I'm a very logical person and had a major book purge about a decade ago. For me, what worked was I broke it up into categories mentally and questioned myself as to what purpose each was supposed to serve.
I found that I often mediated things through the written word. My son pointed out that instead of having all the nature guides, why didn't I just look directly at the trees, etc. That was like a thunderbolt to me. Also I found that I had a fascination with histories of the time I'd already lived through - as though the curtain were being pulled back. Decided I wasn't that all-fired interested at the time and I had already lived through it! Some books I had because they were my father's favorite books and I realized I hoped to understand my long deceased father (who died when I was an adult!) better through his choice of books. Mediating again. Decided I knew the person and that was the place I'd abide. Why complicate things.

Also remembered something my cousin's husband had once challenged me with. He was a very colorful larger than life character. He didn't like that his young son wanted to drink his tea with butter. (yes, I know, that fad's starting up now). I mentioned yak butter in tea in a book I'd read. He said, "Were you there to see this?" No, I'd read it in a book. "Well," he concluded, "the fella who wrote the book, maybe *he* knows because he says he traveled there but *you*, you only read it so you don't know." This helped me tremendously though it may not do much for other folks.

I did like this advice one of the commenters gave about books on the Marie Kondo Q and A thread :
"When you pick up the book you already know with your intuition which pile
it belongs in. If you don't know, its just a discard you don't want to admit
to. Doing it faster actually improves the process because your logical,
hoarding mind hasn't got the time to get involved."

I don't have that many books anymore but I did try out her method and was surprised how many of that small quantity remaining I realized I did not want to want any more. That's not a typo.

Also, one thing I notice is that no matter who the expert is, when they start to talk about books, they get all noble, like it's some separate category of holy items. I like what a friend said, "It's just paper and ink."

I once had a tour of the Library of Congress and the then head librarian stopped as he walked by and addressed the group and took some questions. One thing he told us was that it was commonly believed that the library had a copy of everything ever published. He said that they didn't and furthermore wouldn't want to and far too many books that were published were a waste of trees ( this was maybe 40 years ago before so much talk about environmentalism). Anyway, the group gasped at hearing that he didn't automatically value all books just because they were books. If it's a good enough stance for him, it's good enough for me.

Sadie

I especially liked her suggestions to thank the item for the lessons it taught you, then pass it on- a much more positive take for me than "purging" or "culling", which seems to imply mistakes and regret. It was helpful for me to think what I learned from each item I kept or passed on. The more I "tidy up" my closet, the happier I am with the things I have and the more scrupulous I am about adding new wardrobe items. This book really struck a cord with me and has really helped me to go through all the stages of tidying up (clothes, books, ...) What also helps me sometimes part with something to which I have a sentimental attachment is to take a photo- takes up much less space than the physical object but can be comforting nonetheless.

frannieb

Veteran

I am learning so much wisdom from everyone and am looking forward to beginning the process.

books - I could probably purge my whole collection and what doesn't get purged are books for work and I could take them to work.

love the quote about intuition - that if you don't know it is a discard you just don't want to admit.

Not about the doggie bags from my understanding reading responses here and other places - My doggie bags do not bring me joy but everyday my 4 legged friends bring me joy - So If poop bags are needed for them to be in my life so be it.
I think this is the same with tennis shoes and workout clothes - They don't bring me joy - but working out makes me happy so do have joy I need the utilitarian piece and because of this I can also think I should have a scaled down version of these clothes - just enough to avoid a laundry back up and not in excess.

Not sure if any of that makes sense but it kinda does in my mind.

Anonymous

I'm reading this book this weekend.

krishnidoux

Veteran

I love this thread! Thanks for sharing your experience. You inspire me.

About utilitarian clothes: after many years I finally decided a few years back to give them their deserved space. So I allotted them a drawer, where I put nothing else but. Of course, not everything in the same spot. So I have many such spaces in my bedroom and entrance.
1) In my entrance closet, I installed one of those collapsible fabric hanging shelves, and put my tennis shoes in one compartment, my cap in another, etc.
2) Dedicated two drawers in my bedroom for gymwear (these are smaller drawers).
3) Found a special spot for my gym bag on the floor inside my Ikea style closet, and make sure NEVER to fill it with anything else.

Even if the objects don't "fill out" the space they occupy, I have found it most useful to have a dedicated spot. A drawer that you know, when you open it, that there is that one thing you need inside for you to reach for... and that you can just toss it back there when you are done.

Skirt with wrong fit: either have it altered or it goes. Absolutely.

Style Fan

Veteran

Re: Books

I have not read the book but have read lots of reviews (rave reviews). I did read one woman's conflict with her books. She is a writer and had collected books for many years. I felt a lot of sadness when she wrote about letting her books go and wondered if she would regret it. She had a ritual where she thanked the book and gave it away. I am not technologically skilled but the blog is called Grechen's Closet. I would post the link if I knew how.

I have a lot of books from my work, from reading and just because. I have purged the ones that do not bring me joy over the years. I still have a lot of books. All the novels I read now are on my ereader (Thankfully). I buy hard copies of work books.

To me books are more important than diamonds. I gave my niece my mother's engagement ring. I would give her the rest of my mother's jewellery if she lived closer. My books are staying.

christieanne

Veteran

I read Kondo's book a few weeks back and have been mulling it over. It does seem geared for a Japanese home which means some possible concessions on our part.
I don't have much in the way of true seasonal clothing (no heavy coats or bulky items) but if you have two closets, separating by season seems reasonable but you could still follow the "love it" suggestion for each closet.

We have a lot of books on shelves and even some in boxes. I can let go of a lot of them when I think about how many I will truly re-read or be useful to me.
For example, a new paperback. I know I won't re-read it so donating to library or passing to a friend I can discuss it with later is more fulfilling.
There are still many books to keep after all.
We keep reference books, art books, sentimental books. I have a shelf of children's lit I can't let go of. Some classics. I took my work/business books to work. That way others I work with can borrow them. Some, I am giving away.

I have not redone my dressers yet with the folding method. I am afraid it will be hard to maintain but I still may give it a shot. My sweaters are on a hanging shelf in closet so that won't work in any case.

My thought on the book or any "tidying" system is that you have to take what you need and leave the rest. It may work and may not (workout clothes for example or a basic item). Even applying some of the lessons learned could be a help to you though.

Try the skirt again next week and see if your conscious thinking about it has given you a decision.

unfrumped

Veteran

I like what christieann said about cherry-picking even though that goes against Kondo's point.

MK advises specifically category sorting rather than by room.
That had me quite interested when I read the book, because of the tendency to duplicate items and forget you have multiples (that you might not need) if you just tidy up a room.
Example for me is cleaing supplies. I have been on various "kicks", one the Clean Team supply caddy thing, and then with a 2 -story home, I convinced myself to have upstairs and downstairs items, plus end up with dupes in each bathroom, not only cleaning but tissues, etc. While reading the book, I began to see what items should be duplicated (for my preference) and which were overkill and had products drying out, or a half-bottle of this and that in many places and not being able to easily take stock of supplies. So that kind of tidying really benefits from getting it all out in one place and making some decisions re: maybe having one cleaning caddy centrally and just minimum products elsewhere. This is a project I could do in a couple of hours on a weekend, getting all the products from all areas and only replacing the ones I decide I need ("joy" may be too strong a term for this, but sure, joy= satisfaction).

I would like to do the same for all categories, in sequence as she described, just for the fun and interest of doing a different system, and because I now see the logic behind it, but I can also see that may be a stumbling block for some of the time intervals I have to devote to the project, and so may have break form and do some "room" or "drawer" tidying versus wait. I'm hoping to use a combination and overlap and also use some new "aha" reactions, such as, "why on earth was I keeping this ?", that arise from the categorical approach.

What are your thoughts on relapsing into "tiny chunk tidying" vs. MK's recommendation for the categorical big sweep?

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