Concerning Angie's blog topic yesterday on the phsycology of our perso

tarzy

San - I agree that this is a very interesting topic! When you say you don't intend to give an impression of yourself, do you mean you don't want to be noticed? Or do you mean you have not defined your own style yet?

17 years ago

ImogenL

(website)

Active Member

San - if you got to choose (which you do) how you are percieved by others (as a person) what personality traits would you like people to pick up about you?

Write out a list of words that appeal that relate to your personality, don't worry at this moment about your clothing. First you need to understand who you are, before you can express who you are through your clothes.

17 years ago

shiny

Veteran

If it's helpful, my impression of San is that she is one of the kindest, gentlest people I've ever met. You never have anything but nice things to say to others here. You spread good feelings wherever you go.

I don't know how that would translate into clothes though, but I've been watching you here, and I really admire your way with people.

And I'll add "genuine" to that list because you are so consistent with this, I am sure it must very much be a part of who you are.

If I was feeling down and low and bad about myself, and you were my neighbor, I can imagine I'd want to come over to your house and rest my head on your shoulder for awhile and that you would say all the right things, and I would feel better.

17 years ago

April

Veteran

San, I think of "classic style" in this way: if you saw classic clothing from another era and put it next to classic clothing from today, it would be completely recognizable. It would never look ridiculous, "so 1950s" (60s, 80s, etc.), or be something that one would be embarrassed to wear in modern times. Even classic clothing shifts a bit in its cut and fabrics, but it shifts much more slowly than current fashion. It can be made more modern through accessories, and should never look dowdy (though it can certainly go that way pretty easily if you're not careful), but it's a grown-up style that doesn't date quickly and avoids extremes.

Gee, I sound like I know what I'm talking about, don't I -- this doesn't describe me much at all, but I can recognize it when I see it!

Here are a couple of examples of things I think will look just about as good in a decade or so as they do now:

http://www.brooksbrothers.com/.....8;CurSeq=4

http://www.brooksbrothers.com/.....;CurSeq=5#

17 years ago

julijuli

Active Member

San, I can totally relate to your comment that it's scary. In my opinion, it's scary because you are putting yourself and your personality out to the public and not everyone may like it or approve.

For me, I think that is why I am stuck in the rut of purchasing what I feel are 'classic' clothes but do n ot really express my personality. I think they are safe and won't attract negative attention. But - is that really what I want? No! When I look at pictures in fashion magazines what appeals to me most are modern, but clean classic items that have a twist - a piece or accessory that moves it from boring and safe to something with more style and fun. However, I haven't been able to get that fun part into my wardrobe yet. But - I'm working on it.

17 years ago

Kari

Veteran

I have a hard time too with the concepts in Angie's blog post yesterday. There's a disconnect between what I want to project through my style and what I actually do project.

I think I'm seen as young but professional, modest, and sometimes poised. But I also worry that I'm seen as being too cautious/conservative or boring. I'm especially concerned about this because people always think I'm overly formal when I speak. When I dress in clothes that are perceived as being "dressed up" in the casual Pacific Northwest (wearing smart casual clothes instead of jeans & a tee shirt when I go out), I'm worried that it just reinforces this image and makes people either intimidated or uninterested in getting to know me. It's a part of my personality that can help a lot in professional situations, but I don't think I'm seen as being very warm or funny or approachable, when I'm really a goofball at heart.

I want to be seen as polished and professional but also creative and modern and funny. I'm not sure how to bring that side out since most trendy clothes/concepts look terrible on my body.

17 years ago

tarzy

Veteran

I think Kari makes a good point, something I've always thought about. I think body type has a big influence on personal style.

I love simple, classic, elegant clothes - think of Gwyneth Paltrow. She is tall and thin and looks great in just about anything she wears. I, however, am curvy. Even at my thinnest, I have curves. And I am short, with short legs. I could wear the exact same clothes as Gwyneth, but I would look completely different. I could not adapt that kind of style as my own, because it just doesn't translate to my body. (And wearing 4 inch heels everywhere is not a good solution, although I'm sure some women do it!)

So I've had to search, and are still searching, for ways to wear clothes that are simple, but not boring. For me, that usually means keeping the colors neutral, and limiting the frills and doo-dads. However - because I am curvy, I tend to look good in clothes that work with my curves. I look great in things that have a sort of Victorian/Edwardian/old fashioned look, because in those days women's clothes worked with their curves.

I think this is why so often I just wear black pants and a black top. On my curvy body it feels simple - it doesn't add anything. To me, it's an elegant solution. And perhaps modern? But boring? And then sometimes I feel like I'm losing all my femininity. Aargh!

And then throw in age to complicate things - at 51 I don't want to look silly (as San said), but I also don't want to look like I've given up.

I know there are ways to make body type work with one's personal style - I keep experimenting, but I'm not sure I've hit on the right formula yet.

17 years ago

Angie

(website)

Fashion Stylist

I really like way the this thread is going. Here are a few more things to think about:

o Classic does not equal boring and conservative. Classic is fabulous if that’s in line with your personality. Not everyone is exuberant and loud (thank goodness). I have a handful of very classic clients and I wouldn’t think of making modern or trendy. They look perfect and true to themselves in classic CURRENT attire. They’d look and feel odd in modern trendy clothing.

o As you get older you become more in tune with who you are. More set in your ways. Discovering which clothes and styles fit your personality is a process. Also, a personality trait does not need to be overt. You might be shy with a devilishly dry sense of humour that you show only after you get to know someone a little better.

o There is no doubt that body type plays a role, but messages can still be conveyed strongly despite one’s body type. I have a size 20W client who is amongst my most stylist clients. She has a superb sense of taste and is completely in tune with what she wants to convey about herself through the way that she puts herself together. Its magical. And dressing and feeling fabulous is a size 20W body type is challenging. On the other hand, I have a tall, size 4-6 client who is built like a supermodel but really battles to be and look stylish. I also have two age 69 clients whom I regard as extremely stylish. Once again ladies, style is NOT a size, age or budget. Style begins and ends with a strong sense of yourself. You have to dress from the inside out because that’s when you are confident. And when you’re confident – you are effortlessly stylish.

o San, I have had the pleasure of meeting you and have seen with my own eyes that you are not only an absolutely kind-hearted honey-pie, but that you also have an unusually rocking hot body for your age. You can literally wear anything. But I feel that’s hard for you accept because you are shy and do not like to draw attention to yourself, which is why you are most happy when you dress down, down, down. But you actually also really like fun colourful things because you are a really positive and cheerful person. But you’re not happy wearing them because they make a bold statement, and San does NOT like to be instantly noticed. And that is okay! Tell me if I’m making sense and I’ll carry on.

o Tara, my darling Tara, it is one of my life’s missions to get you out of wearing a black top with black pants! This combination does not do you as a person justice (and it’s also not flattering). Black from head to toe can be done but it’s hard to pull off. But I 100% support your preference to stick to neutrals – this can be a beautiful style which I know you can pull off.

17 years ago

Maya

Veteran

I agree 100% with what Shiny said about you, San. I don't know what that means as far as clothes go. You have mentioned being shy before, and you do seem very quiet and gentle. For me that would translate to a clean, understated style. Now, let me speak generally and not specifically about you: what if you don't LIKE a clean and understated style? I don't think you're necessarily tied to that. My style is pretty colorful and cheerful, but I'm not really very outgoing or cheerful myself. I'm pretty calm and not easily excitable or extroverted, but I wouldn't know what to do with myself if I had to dress that way. I just have a preference from an aesthetic standpoint. I genuinely admire and am impressed by women who can pull off muted or neutral color palettes, but I can't. Lots of times, things that might suit our personalities won't be right on our bodies.

I agree with Tara that body type plays a huge role, at least for me. When I think of style icons that I admire, I think of Twiggy. But if I were to wear the same clothes, besides being unflattering, they just wouldn't have the same effect. I hate to say it, but I think whether we like it or not, or we intend to or not, people will make judgments based on our body types. I share Angie's preference for modesty, but it's really impossible to be modest when you're full-busted. Even when you have the intention, as I do, you're always going to show cleavage, and given the chance, people will always have something to say about it, and assume that you're "showing off" or doing it on purpose (otherwise you would wear a turtleneck, of course)...especially when you're like me and wear a small size but have a big bust. FTR, someone was kind enough to describe my body as "porn star" proportioned. Needless to say we haven't spoken much since.

So while I would like to say modest, I'll never be able to without compromising. We all saw how bad I looked in a high neckline, so I can't say I haven't tried. In any case, I don't think it helped. Even with lots of coverage, it just makes the boobs look even bigger. I can, of course, chalk this up to people's ignorance, but unfortunately their ignorance can wield a lot of influence. To me, a curvy and voluptuous figure is a very classic (and classical) body type, so I often find myself dressing that way, even though it isn't reflective of my personal style at all. I am just drawn to it because I know it will look good on me.

I think trying to convey your personality through your clothes is a personal choice and not a must. If something looks good on me, I'll just wear it. Finding clothes that are flattering and fit well is an annoying enough task without having to add a psychological dimension to it. Sometimes I manage to pull an outfit together that is reflective of my personal style and flattering for my body type...but still wont' accurately represent my personality. It's too tall of an order for me.

As far as classic style, I interpret it as items, colors, patterns, textures, and silhouettes that are timeless, and frequently (though not necessarily) universally flattering. Modern classic is just the most recent iteration of those concepts, at least that's my interpretation. Could be wrong.

17 years ago

judy

Veteran

San,, love your honesty. Personally, I think it's just fine that you don't have the impression you want to give on your mind! It can be more about being comfortable and easy in the world with our attention available for other things...and I find clothes can help us do that....and we don't have to look like we are mowing the lawn :).

If style is the way we move through the world, then no matter what the occasion, somehow that style comes across to others. We use words to describe it, but the style isn’t in the words, it’s in you. I would guess from what you have shared and shown us here on the forum that your style might tend toward relaxed, no fuss, simple and straightforward with lovely clean lines. It sounds as though you might feel that your style is lying dormant, like a sleeping beauty…? If so, what will be your charming prince to wake it up? ☺ Have you ever noticed that when you see beauty around you, you feel beautiful..? ….and then we radiate that beauty and express it through our clothing choices….through everything we do. Style choices can be the way we express appreciation for beauty.

Here’s a quote I ran into this week: "Fashion is not something that exists in dresses only. Fashion is in the sky, in the street, fashion has to do with ideas, the way we live, what is happening." –Coco Chanel.

I find style evolves and changes as we do…it’s a process and a learning. It seems like it never ends, but I don’t want it to, because it’s so much fun to pay attention to what clothes and looks catch my eye and that I feel good wearing. Think of it like food or music, there are some styles of music or notes that we love and others not so much…we don’t even have to think about it. Same with food. Clothes might take more education but perhaps it is simply the same principle inside of us…? We bring home from the store what looks good to us and we create with that. It doesn’t necessarily take expensive ingredients. We use recipes in the beginning, but as we gain confidence, we might switch out this for that in a recipe…and taste again. Did it work? Did we like it? Clothes can be the same. We won’t arrive at a point with food or music where we say “this is my style and I’m all set now”…because tomorrow we’ll need to eat again and there is new music all the time, just like new clothes!

I find also that clothing choices can be overwhelming if I think too much about “getting it right”. And if getting it right is mostly on my mind, I will feel wrong ☺! Since you and I are very close in age and body type, San…though you are taller than me!, I wanted to write this today to hopefully make you feel better and happier about the adventure of it and not to be discouraged. We have every reason to feel confident and beautiful!

17 years ago

Tanya

Veteran

San, this is a great discussion and I can totally relate. I also know what I do not want to be perceived as. Apart from that, I know what type of clothing I like, but necessarily what kind of message it gives, although it sure must give some. But soon in a future when I hopefully get a job, I will be thinking of it in reverse, figuring out first what message I want to give and than picking clothes to portray that while still trying to stay true to my taste.

I agree that you are a very kind and generous person. It is always nice to read your posts. And I think that it is OK not to want to give too much info about your self with your clothing, we are all very different. To me that would translate into an understated style , more modern than classic ( some fashion books call it 'chic'), with one nice touch in a form of a pretty color or interesting detail.

17 years ago

Angie

(website)

Fashion Stylist

Actually, Tanya has hit the nail on the head (thanks for chiming in Tanya – I appreciate your simple and astute words). The point is not that you HAVE to consciously and overtly convey what’s in your head through your clothes. In fact if you choose not to, you've actually conveyed a message. Has the penny dropped?

Most of you will find that you actually are ALREADY innately conveying your personalities through what you wear and how you put yourselves together. My question tpo you is that it’s fun to think about whether your style is in line with how you perceive yourself and how others perceive you.

My darling youlookfabbers, this is not supposed to be a stressful, overwhelming and complicated self – assessment process. It’s truly a fun and insightful process. No one is judging you as you realize things about yourself and how that translates into your style. It all depends on how you choose to view the process.

17 years ago

Anonymous

Thankyou for helping me figure this out, and thankyou for the compliments, such an ego boost.
I guess I have been waiting for something external to happen and then I would have achieved the 'state of stylishness'. Now I'm looking at it more as the style is already inside me and it is unique to me like everything else about me. So the confusing part then is how do I fit into the catagories like classic, boho, etc? Maybe it is more obvious to others than it is to myself.
Another part to this is like Angie said I am not one who wants to be noticed when I walk in a room, and that may conflict with what I am attracted to on the hanger. So yes indeed Angie please do carry on with your thoughts, ofcourse.
I LOVE getting to the bottom of this because it will be a big breakthrough for me, and I'm sure many others who have the same limitation on understanding the concepts.
Shiny I smiled when I read your post about if 'I was your neighbor'. Just yesterday at my sewing class, another student said to me, "I hope you are in all my sewing classes because you make me feel confidant in what I am doing". How's that for a coincidence.

17 years ago

Patience

Veteran

San, I also see you as everyone else here has described. I also have no doubt that you are confident in who you are. Maybe it is just that this is your first opportunity to expressing that through your clothing and that is a little overwhelming. Angie said what I was going to say which is that it is a lot more simple than you are making it out to be. In other words, if you are confident in who you are, it is bound to come out in your style. And you are so confident in yourself (I think) that there is no risk of you conveying something you do not want to. So please start from who you are inside and go from there, even if it is a slow process. If you start from the outside trying to find clothes that define who you are, you are just limiting and overwhelming yourself. And in fact, I suspect that your difficulties to do that actually arise from the fact that you are so confident of yourself inside. Does that make sense?

If you find it confusing to fit into categories like classic or boho, they are obviously not helping you, so forget them. Maybe you can figure it out after the fact.

I do think it's important to investigate the equations we make in our minds. For example, if you believe that who San is is someone who would prefer not to be noticed when you walk in the room, why is that? Actually why bother with that at all? I think if you start from who you are you will be received into a room just as you would want to be.

17 years ago

Anonymous

Well said everyone and I love when Patience said if trying to figure what catagories I fit into isn't helping than just forget the catagories. Yes why make it so complicated.
What a relief to know that I do have style just like everyone else does, only mine is unique like me.
This was an interesting topic Angie. Everyone who was able to answer what their style conveyed, seemed so right on I thought.
Thanks for the food for thought Angie. I LOVE how you mix style with phsycology.
Also it is good to know that we are "youlookfabbers"! HaHa!

17 years ago

Lena

Active Member

I don't have much to add at the moment, just wanted to say this thread is fascinating and I'll reread it againlater. San, you got some really good advice here. Don't give up, you're on the right track.

Judy, I like your food and cooking analogy. I'm beginning to notice that I approach food and cooking in much the same way I approach dressing and style. For example, I rarely stick to recipes, I'm always tinkering and adjusting. I often have to stop myself from trying to stuff too many spices into one single dish. Similarly, I frequently catch myself cramming too many moods and styles into one outfit.

17 years ago

Ana

(website)

Veteran

I really love this thread, and everyone has kind of taken the words right out of my mouth.

I love Patience's point. She said, "I think if you start from who you are you will be received into a room just as you would want to be. " I think that's the important part. The way we dress and do our hair and all that is only part of the package. You said yourself that for everyone on here who could answer as to what their style was and what it conveyed seemed to fit them. I agree. I think this is partly due to the fact that we get a strong sense of a someone's personality on this forum. Even though we've never met in person (well, some of us) and our main contact is through typing messages on the computer, we can see distinct personalities come through. That's amazing, isn't it? And we are able to see bits of that personality we've come to know manifested in how they dress, not the other way around. Does that make sense?

I completely agree with everyone's assessment of you on here San, and when Shiny said she would love to have you as a neighbor because you would be a good, non-judgmental listener, that was exactly my impression of you as well.

I couldn't say for certain what kind of message my clothing conveys to other people, because I think a lot of that is up to the interpretation of whoever is looking at me. I do know that there are personality quirks I have that come out in my appearance. Even if no one else notices them, I do. Brendan does sometimes too, which makes me laugh. I think this is true with everyone. But the point is that you have to get to know someone first before you would notice something like this. So, I just try to dress in a way that makes me happy. I wear things I like, and at the same time, I try to give the impression to people that I am someone worth getting to know better. I don't think you have to have "style" to do this. At the very least, as long as your clothes are clean and neat, you're okay. You definitely already have this down, San. So now it's just up to you to find clothes that make you happy wearing them. If the other stuff is getting in the way of you doing that, then (as Patience said), just forget about that.

17 years ago

ImogenL

(website)

Active Member

This is very interesting. From what others have said about your personality I"d say you'd most comfortably fit into what I called the 'relaxed feminine' style of clothing. There is no one way of doing this, but many, so you need to think about what you like, and start putting together these elements that speak to you.

You need relaxed clothes that are comfortable, with fabrics that you find kinisthetically pleasing, often the colours that appeal to someone who is relaxed are what I call the colours of nature (blues, greens, browns, sand, rust etc). You probably veer away from prints apart from maybe a stripe or check.

Feminine can be expressed in so many ways, from clothes that create a feminine shape (so not baggy or boxy), to sparkle, frills, florals and flare. Feminine colours tend to be lighter pastels. Some like lace or ribbon detail, others like soft floaty fabrics.

Have a look through some magazines or websites, and pull out pictures of clothes that appeal to you that you would feel comfortable wearing. This will help you define your personal style.

17 years ago

Dawn

(website)

Active Member

This is such an interesting topic. I literally have been thinking about this since Angie posted the blog yesterday.

San, I would associate words like warm, friendly and approachable with you. You always have lovely things and friendly advice for people on the forum.

One particular thing that I think is important in this whole topic is what message you want to give out about yourself. For example, I gave feminine as one of my style qualities. However, most of the time I do not act in ways that most people would define as a very feminine or girly person. For example, I am a mountain biker, and the trait that most people would associate with many female adventure sport nuts is that we are tomboys and anti-girly girls. However I would like to give off the impression that I am not a tomboy so I emphasise certain feminine elements in my style. I do have a feminine side to my personality but people tend to dismiss that when they hear about my hobbies, so I choose to highlight it in my clothing choices.

Maybe something you could think about is what impression do you wish for people to have when you walk into a room. For me, these are fun, approachable, intelligent, feminine and sexy. What are they for you?

17 years ago

Anonymous

These posts have been interesting reading and thought provoking. Rather than fit into a style catagory, I may be a mood dresser like Shiny. I'm not really concerned about what style I fit into. I just know that I dress to please myself first and that if I'm not pleased with how I look on a given day, it can affect my energy and attitude and even how I relate to others.
Compliments are nice but not necessary for confidence. It comes from inside...for better or worse.

San, to me classic style is timeless clothing like sheath dresses, pencil skirts, button-down shirts, well cut trousers and blazers, for example. These can be tweaked and updated, but always seem to be around in some form.

YLF has helped me to branch out and try new things rather than play it safe. I find that I love doing that. Result? People tell me that I'm looking younger, but I think it's an attitude they sense more than any physical change. I still have my grey hair!

17 years ago

Anonymous

Thanks so much. I have a lot of thinking to do. I can't tell you all how much your input means to me and your suggestions have very much helped clear the subject and point me in the right direction. I appreciate your kind words very much too. Youlookfabbers are awesome.

17 years ago

Laura

(website)

Veteran

San, can you post a list of a few characteristics that you think describe you best? I would love to know that so we can help you as we watch you create your style.

For example, I absolutely loved you in the grey William Rast vest and white blouse. It seems so perfect for you: the ruffled bottom feature of the blouse added soft femininity to the look, and the muted grey and white color palette seemed to suit you too. That plus the fact that you totally rocked those COH jeans!!

17 years ago

anne

Veteran

A most interesting thread San. I don't have much to add except that I have tended to think of your style as what I (in Australia) call sporty

17 years ago

hanna

(website)

Active Member

this is such and interesting topic san, and ladies far wiser than i have already put their two cents in. i did want to say, though, that i agree with laura - why not let us know what characteristics you think are synonymous with you? having that in mind can really help us as we try to help you with your style. that said, i do agree with everyone on their assessment of your personality - you are warm, kind and generous, and in previous threads, especially when i was so down about body image when i was home, you really were such a comfort.

17 years ago

bella

(website)

Veteran

This is a great topic and I am sorry I've been late to comment.

I agree with others San that from your posts you come across as a very kind person, who always looks at the issue from various different viewpoints. It is wonderful trait in my opinion that one can only have with a lot of experience and tolerance towards the world.

I agree a with Tara. Angie is right to point out that one can send any message with any type but I still find that there are certain styles I would like to project which don't look as good as other styles on me. I also like simple, elegant, sophisticated clothes on other but I think I look a bit blah in them.

17 years ago

crwilson

Veteran

So many of these posts have resonated with me! I'm new to this, so I don't have any great advice. I find the whole process quite frightening as well. Most of my fashion/style life is spent trying to find things that fit and don't look too bad. Like you, San, I have a better sense of what I don't want to look like than what I do want to look like.

Even once you figure out what impression you want to project, I find it difficult to figure out how to apply that knowledge and pick out clothes that convey that impression.

17 years ago

Anonymous

You guys have been great and I appreciate all the thoughts on the subject. I feel more clear in that I already have my own style and I don't have to name it if that doesn't come easy to me. I've learned from this exercise to ask myself everyday what my appearance is saying to the world about me. This will be fun. I may even start a journal. I will work on a list of characteristics I see in myself that would be the ones I would like to put out there. I find it interesting that a few others also think it is easier to say what we don't want to convey than what we do want to convey to the world through style.
I am seeing quotes by Coco Channel here and there and boy she really knew how to express her sense of style, as do many of you here on the forum.
This quote by Coco Chanel I coppied from a header on a blog:

How many cares one loses when one decides not to be something but to be someone....Coco Chanel

I can't wait for Angie's book to come out (hint hint)! I'm starting rumors now.

17 years ago

Patience

Veteran

San, I think that quote says it all.

Maybe it's not clear, but I'm one of those who find the categories to get in the way more than help. I also find it difficult to articulate what I'm going for when it comes to fashion. My method is just to go with what I like and learn as much as I can here.

17 years ago

Anonymous

Yes Patience, and it has been a good subject to mull over here. It sounds like several of us have been set free of feeling we were the only ones who just didn't 'get it'. I know I do feel free of thinking there is a secret that I am just not getting, very liberating.

17 years ago

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