Chewy, is this the issue?

http://www.glamour.com/magazin.....x_20090601

A bit of inane but sort of relevant information for this thread:

I dressed a client who went to the Oscars this year who reported back this information. She was on the red carpet with ALL the stars. She saw them ALL up close. She said that they looked really disappointing irl. They look MUCH better on camera and in photo shoots because of photo shop and make up. She got to sit next to Sally Field and Meryl Streep the entire evening, and said that Meryl Streep was by far the best looking star that night. A woman in her late 50’s (I think).

So to your point CS and Bella – I totally agree.

LOL you all are so funny!

San, I feel the same way about my back view lately. I think my butt has slipped to my knees.

Last night I caught a glimpse of my elbows in the mirror .... and I am now determined to keep my arms bent always at 90 degree angles. Perhaps I should reconsider satchel purses?

The long crazy eyebrow hairs!!! OMG! This is sooo true for me. I am constantly cutting this single hair that keeps growing out of control.

Nose hair - sorry you're going to have to pluck. Do it before you put on your mascara, because you will tear up.

Chin hairs: anyone else get these? I actually shave my chin. There are maybe 3-4 hairs that come in thick, dark, coarse, and then grow like wildfire. I started shaving them a few years ago. If I forget, there's stubble you can feel. Yech.

They say you can save your face or your fanny. Which are you going to choose? My DH has chosen his fanny. I'm on the fence - I want to save both!!

Yikes!!

*running to bathroom mirror*

*checking face*

*Can't see*

*putting on magnifying glasses*

*Holy Cow!!! Are those purse strings???*

*faints*

Debra- yes that is the issue.
You know for me, one of the worst things is that you will hear people saying "Oh, so-and-so looks so GREAT for her age!" and then I see a picture of them. 99% of the time, that person has had obvious (to me anyway) work done on them and looks (to me) very unnatural. Or, the person has a great body- that you know they have to be doing all kinds of crazy stuff to keep at their age, and their face looks terrible- probably from all of the crazy exercise/dieting.
I remember when Desperate Housewives was first coming out. My dad was an extra in the pilot episode (if anyone has it- he opens the door for Terri Hatcher at Mary Alice's house after the funeral), and I remember him saying how great Terri Hatcher looked. When I saw it, I thought she looked terrible- bags under her eyes and too skinny.
I just want to see women aging naturally and to have that be accepted, I guess.

Shiny, I swear I can go to bed with no chin hairs and wake up with one three inches long! I have a long white one that appears on my neck every few weeks. It gets plucked but I never seem to catch it when it's short.
The things our moms and aunties never tell us! They just smiled small knowing smiles when I claimed I'd never get a tummy or flabby arms. Gotta see if I can pluck up the courage to get those nose hairs tonight. If I could drink, I'd have a stiff gin and tonic first.

OMG this is hysterical !! I have the opposite problem... I don't have the facial hair.... my eyebrows have all but disappeard, and I am a bruenett !!, I rarley shave the legs and pitts but every few days, no hair on the arms...does this happen past 50 and post meno...??

The baggy elbows are something I notice too Shiny.:)

To Chewey's point, I have a friend who has a ton of work done, and well, she just looks odd to me now. I have a million miles of * memories * on my face and refuse to alter those.

Taylor, about the worked on faces- it has gotten so out of control. There are so many older actresses destroying their looks with injections and implants and lifts. I want to beg them all to stop. I dated a producer who said they get so frustrated in casting for older women because women show up with no wrinkles, yet they don't look young enough to cast "young". They just look odd.

I understand the pressure in Hollywood to stay young- I was in that business. I just wish some plastic surgeon would stand up and say "no, this isn't working- we have to stop". And I love that we have Meryl Streep and Diane Keaton and a few others willing to be real and look wonderful doing it.

Ok. That's out of my system. Sorry for the rant, but this really bugs me.

Taylor, you made a very good point. Those are miles of *memories* on our faces and a record of all our joy and tears over the years. What a wonderful way to view our faces. We do need to be comfortable in our bodies and if we can laugh about it, all the better.

Sinead, great examples! Just wanted to add Jamie Lee Curtis to the list as another great actress who is unwilling to give in to the pressures of Hollywood.

I love Jamie Lee Curtis! I saw her one time at Disneyland with her daughter.

Well, don't even get me started on boob jobs , talk about disfiguring your body.

I don't know about you ladies, but I wouldn't want to be any other age(insert your age) than I am right now, would you?? I think with each age comes soooo much life, the good the bad and even the ugly....:)

You lot crack me up.

Hollywood is unreal and magazines are even less real. It must be very hard being an actress when you are past your prime and don’t have a successful career that stands the test of aging time (like Judie Dench). Susan Sarandon has not had any work done and its visibly noticeable when she’s with other actresses who are just a little younger than her who have had it all done. It’s very stressful to be professionally pretty for 30 years of your adult life.

Ladies, thanks for such honest descriptions! And you all are so funny and confident, it really makes me feel better about aging!

I actually already noticed this thing with the butt creeping south, and I am only 36! On the bright side, I don't check my backside in the mirror that often, and it is not constantly in my face (ahem...), so I don't mind too much.

Tara, I am your fellow "ample bosom" - I swear, my bust increased 3 cup sizes in the last years! With each pregnancy it expanded and never shrank back Now whenever I hear young moms discussing how sad it is that their great cleavage went away when they stopped breastfeeding, I want to strangle them (or, if I am in a charitable mood, to offer to trade places with them). And, really, I was never lacking in this department even before that growth. It is like having a "boob job" without actually doing it

Susan Sarandon and Meryl Streep are really beautiful women, and they look far better than these botoxed-to-death actresses. But I think that the real models for aging gracefully are the French actresses. Juliette Binoche is so beautiful and natural, and she is 45 - I bet American actresses already consider some "work" to be done when they are this age. And Emmanuelle Beart is apparently 44 (just found this out now) - in addition to being naturally stunning, she is not afraid to appear in movies where her character is supposed to be less-than-pretty. Oh, and Fanny Ardant is 60 - isn't she beautiful? And Isabelle Adjani (who is 54)? And finally, Charlotte Rampling - she is 63 and is drop-dead gorgeous, and I don't think she ever had any "work done". OK, you can see that I watch many French movies

Ladies, did you notice the snoring problem that comes with age, or is it just me? I swear, once I was quiet as a mouse in my sleep, and not I either wake up in panic because I am unable to breath through my nose, or my husband tells me that I snore

Shiny, satchel purses sound very glamorous! If this is where we are all heading, it sounds quite exciting: when we are 80, we will walk around carrying satchel purses, wearing huge sun hats or turbans (always looked to me like a type of a hat for which you need to be at least 70 to pull it off), and have our hair naturally gray in a very stylish cut

Hannah- we are the same age as well as living in similar climates!

Luckily, my rear is heading north rather than south due to the weight loss, but please don't tell me that my boobs are going to get bigger!

I'm sorry to admit it, but I've always had a snoring problem- since I was a little kid, actually. My sister tape recorded me once because I didn't believe her.

My daughter actually met Susan Sarandon at one of Patricia Field's parties in NYC. The very first question I asked her was how did she look. She reported back that she was stunning and a natural beauty.

As for Patricia Field (stylist for Sex and the City and Devil Wears Prada), here is a woman who thumbs her nose at convention! I believe she is in her 60's and has her own wildly unique fashion sense. She is hard to miss with her flaming red hair and flamboyant style. Good for her!

Hannah, I am with you on French actresses - also would add Nathalie Baye to the list. I did see Fanny Ardant in a fairly recent film and almost fell off my chair. I agree, they go for the natural look, although I suspect they do get *some* jobs done. I also think the lighting in French films is softer and in general more flattering - even young Emmanuelle Beart didn't look half as good as normal in one of MI installments (forget which one).
I personally find the whole magazine culture quite appalling, but I understand that people in the spotlight are under a lot of pressure. Also, pardon my ignorance, but who is Miley Cyrus? (I sound so much like my grandma )

Older French woman ROCK, ROCK, ROCK. That’s exactly what I said in my Parisian post last year. It’s not the younger gals in France who blow you away, it’s the older lasses. I’ll add to the list of gloriously beautiful French women: Catherine Deneuve (in her 70’s), Carol Bouquet (50’s) and Ines Fressange (50’s). Then there’s British Helen Mirren who holds a special place in my heart too (I think she's pushing 60).

Adorable Marianne, Miley Cyrus is an American teenage performer who sings and dances. She was on a show too. She’s the daughter of the bloke who sung “achie breakie heart” in the 80’s.

Thanks Angie! I need to brush up on my pop culture - I noticed that I stopped recognizing most people on magazine covers in the store

I love Ines de la Fressange. I e-mailed this to my stylist and asked if I could have her haircut. She said no - it would take too long for me to style. So sad. This is what I want to look like when I grow up!

http://i387.photobucket.com/al.....ssange.jpg

OMG Tarzy, what a great style. Are you a wash and wear kind of girl? (Meaning do you shampoo and then not blow dry? or style?)

If you actually style your hair , or spend 15 min with it, I would think this would be achievable for you.:) Knowing that your stylist knows you best, I would heed her advice.

I think we need to start a new thread where we gush over older French actresses!

Catherine Deneuve is amazing, but wears too much makeup, IMHO. I recently read an article somewhere which said that French women go for natural look and usually use very little makeup (for instance, Juliette Binoche, who is my favorite actress ever, hardly wears any at all), and that Catherine Deneuve's abundance of makeup is met with a raised eyebrow.

Carol Bouquet - of course! How could I forget! And Ines de la Fressange is breathtaking. I somehow thought she is a model, though, not an actress? Tara, I think you will look great with a similar haircut! Taylor says it is not too much styling, and she is an expert

I am adding Nathalie Baye to my list of amazing-looking French actresses - thanks, Marianne!

The only French actresses mentioned that I have seen are Catherine Deneuve and Juliet Binoche who are gorgeous.
The picture of Ines de la Fressange that Tara posted is beautiful, love the name and her hair style makes me want to buy a set of hot rollers.
Angie, what is it that makes these women so alluring? Perhaps one just has to be French to have it? Is it the sound of the language, the swagger, the attitude, what?

Taylor - I am very much wash and wear. My hair gets curlier when it's shorter, so I'm always afraid of going too short - I don't want to end up looking like a poodle. But having seen San's great new cut, I'm tempted to go shorter now.

Oh, Tara, thanks for posting that photo of Ines. She's one of my style icons and when I first started trying to pull myself out of frumpville, she was one of the mature stylish women I studied on style.com.

On French women- I think there is a paradox at work here. They put effort into looking pulled together- yet they also have a look of not trying too hard. When I see a fashionable American woman, and everything is perfect, hair and makeup, it can look too ...done. Does anyone know what I mean?

And I think there is also a huge difference in lifestyle that shows in the style and on the face of French women- finding pleasure in the everyday things, food, aesthetics. That's just so hard in our hyperspeed culture here in the U.S. One of my friends told me a French women who was temporarily working here told her "In the States, I feel like a human DOING- in France, I feel like a human BEING".

Sinead - I was an actress too! I still live in LA, and I sometimes think I should let my hair go grey, get a fabulous short cut, and go for the "older women" roles. I could never compete with the gorgeous starlets when I was younger, but now I could go for those "DA, Judge, Politician roles." But I hate the thought of getting back into all of that auditioning and never feeling like you're quite good enough, thin enough, perfect enough.

Are you in LA?

Tara-I had to take off for a run to DSW. Scored! Black "interview worthy" pumps for $16.00 (with coupon). And they're comfy! Doing a happy, happy dance...

I'm no longer in LA (lived in lovely No. Hollywood in an apartment straight out of Dragnet.) I live in Seattle now. I worked in the business here for a while, mostly doing commercials and commercial print work. But I quit once I had kids. I have also thought about getting back into it, as an older woman, but there isn't that much work here. It would be like a little hobby I guess, and I know what you mean about the whole auditioning and headshots, etc.

One of my memorable auditions- the casting director for the soap "One Life to Live" called me in and I was feeling pretty good, she had given my agent good feedback on previous auditions. I walk in and she goes, "Oh, god! I forgot you were so flat. You have to have boobs for this part." Ha! I actually appreciated her honesty- knew I wouldn't get a callback on that one.

I wish we could have a glass of wine and exchange war stories!

Sinead is in Seattle.

Quite right HannaC – Ines was a super model and still is.

San, it’s part of French culture to pay attention to how you look (blokes too). French teens use cosmetics at an early age and skin treatment is a must (for blokes too). On top of that the culture is extremely confident. There is no other way but the French way when you’re French. This becomes extremely clear when you actually live in France - which we have. And even clearer when you’re NOT French! (Which we aren’t).

Woooohoo Tara! Go shorter!

Sinead, the compulsory 35 hour work week in France leaves plenty of time to enjoy life which is to your point. The joys of a social democracy – which will also frustrate the hek out of you if you’re not used to it.

My goodness, there is no end to the talent on this forum. We now have actresses among us! Where are the astronauts?

AMAZING! We have actresses on our forum. Pretty darn fab!

I dunno. Like Angie, i lived in France for years, and I saw that those actresses have had PLENTY of surgical work. When I was in Paris, Emmanuelle Beart appeared topless on the cover of French Elle and everyone was commenting about her latest boob job as well as her "bouche de canard" (duck lips... from plastic surgery/ injections, not sure which).

I agree that Ines de la Fressange is gorgeous and has impeccable style, but she's in that business (was a model for years, then had her own fashion line, and now is egerie for a shoe brand - Clergerie, I think) so she has lots of stylists at her disposal and knows that world very well (just as I think American style mavens like Vera Wang and J Crew's Jenna Lyons always look remarkable).

I'm NOT knocking these french women, but since I'm neither American nor French but have lived in both countries, I'm always amazed to see/ hear how even the ugliest/ least stylish French woman has such confidence in "french style" wheres even gorgeous Americans with "killer" style go on and on about how much better Europeans do it. Every country has its beauties and its style godesses. And every country has its style victims.

Now... back to the topic of Kendall Farr's book... I'm currently reading it and, like Debbie, I find parts of it difficult to understand. Sometimes, she uses fashion terms that I have to google: apparently I ought to be wearing portrait necklines and stovepipe pants, neither of which I could picture until finding them online. I style can't be sure I "get" stovepipe pants; are they what we'd call straight-legged?

A line that totally jumped out at me tonight was, "A trained eye will serve you just as well as a bottomless bank account." It made me think of how many style mistakes I've made and continue to make, and how Angie is helping us all train our eye and shape our thinking so we can make better style choices. I'm always amazed, coming on this site, how many women here manage to look amazing while spending not much money, because you have learned what works for your bodies and your lifestyles and are disciplined in your shopping; I have a lot to learn from all of you.

Umm... correction of above post... I think it's "vivier" not "clergerie."