https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really Style Advice for Fashion Lovers en-US Sat, 04 Apr 2026 05:20:48 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/search.php https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876832 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 15:09:51 +0000 ironkurtin 876832@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>We can always all have our own definition of frumpy, but I definitely agree with joyless dressing.</p> <p>Not to offend anyone, but in NYC there are sects of Orthodox Jews who wore what I always considered the height of frump: long, thick pleated dark wool skirts with blocky square wool blazers or heavy cardigans, button-down shirts, thick skin-toned stockings, and chunky oxfords. Then a short bob wig and a tam. This uniform - it really was like a schoolgirl uniform made for grownups - was worn by every woman summer and winter, at every age and in every body size. It was so unflattering *and was meant to be for modesty and religious reasons.* </p> <p>To me, frumpy is shapeless, unflattering, and joyless. It is about ignoring or hiding the shape of the real body underneath the clothing, from shame (or modesty), not caring, or from disinterest in fit.</p> <p>Is the Man Repeller frumpy? No, because she isn't joyless.</p> <p>Is frumpy a judgement? Yes. But then, so is fab. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876767 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 14:12:34 +0000 Molly L-R 876767@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Oh, I completely agree, Ruth! I'm 29 and pastels are definitely not my friends </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876621 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 12:05:16 +0000 Anonymous 876621@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Pastels can be tricky on any woman. I wore them back when I was in my early 20s, and they washed me out something awful. You don't have to be older to look horrible in certain colors. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876592 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 10:43:49 +0000 Molly L-R 876592@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>There seems to be a consensus on here that fit and silhouette have an important role to play in frumpiness, or lack there of. For what it's worth, the things below are what I believe you have to be veeeeeeeeeery careful of as they can be frump tastic if not deployed with care:</p> <p> - midi skirts. Especially when pleated and worn with flats. Alexa Chung only gets aways with it because she's a super skinny fashionista.</p> <p>- beige. I.e. the shade of beige that the walls of most municipal buildings are painted in. It's hard to look stylish when you're the same colour as your wrokplace.</p> <p>- baggy cardigans that end mid-thigh. Shapeless, looks like an item being worn for warmth only.</p> <p>- shoes with a low (1"-1 1/2") block heel. The Guardian's fashion section says these are on trend for 2013. I, for one will not be partaking as they just scream, "sensible!"</p> <p>- shoes that look orthopaedic, but aren't actually orthopaedic shoes. It is possible to buy comfortable shoes that look good. It may take a bit more work, but the results are definitely worth it.</p> <p>- tapered polyester trousers in a plain colour. Just joyless and make your bum look bigger.</p> <p>- pastels can be tricky on an older woman. The wrong shade can make you look washed out. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876560 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 09:05:28 +0000 Mander 876560@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I think joyless is a good concept here, and a certain amount of unkempt. Certainly when I put on something that makes me feel frumpy, it is usually something that fits poorly, is not just unflattering but actively emphasizes parts of my body that I'd rather have fade into the background, appears to be dirty or worn out, looks cheap, or is dated. Conservative, classic, or professional sometimes get labelled as frumpy but I don't think they are the same thing.</p> <p>When I worked in an office in my early 20s I was particularly bad at dressing. My "business" clothes appeared frumpy to me because of the unflattering fit and dated styles more than anything else. I generally went by the criteria that if I can get my body into it and it zips without problems, then it fits. Many of the clothes I wore then were hand me downs from my mother, who is a bit bigger and a whole lot shorter than me, so I was often seen in pants that were too short and too big with a shapeless untucked blouse. If you combine those with a perpetual bad hair day, you get frump. At the time I was quite severely depressed and thought I was too ugly to bother trying to look nice most of the time, so you can see where the joylessness comes in.</p> <p>But I don't think that dated or unflattering is necessarily frumpy. I often see little old ladies around town wearing outfits that are a bit shapeless and dated but they I wouldn't call them frumpy because they are wearing impeccable suits or calf length skirts with matching jackets, coordinated accessories, nice shoes, and have fixed their hair and makeup. The styles of these items may be dated, and they are often made from materials like double knit polyester, but I wouldn't say the overall effect is frumpy. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876550 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 08:08:02 +0000 Hil 876550@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I can totally echo what Echo said if you will 'scuse the awful pun! ;)</p> <p>As a plus size girl, I can say that I see loads of outfits that I reckon if I were thinner I could pull off - it looks intentional and styled, but the minute I put them on, I look frumpy and dull. I do think that age and size has loads to do with it. </p> <p>I also think it is the eye of the beholder. I love my volume over volume look sometimes and I have a particular outfit that I love... my wide leg black pants with a hi lo, loose fitting striped top and ballet flats - I feel comfy, casually stylish and great and my happiness factor in that is high... well it was until DH said it looked like I was turning into my 73 year old mother. And my mother IMO is very frumpy. She always has been - no concept of wearing clothes to fit. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876487 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 04:26:19 +0000 Laura (rhubarbgirl) 876487@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Echo, I agree, I think when you are plus-size it's "easier" to look frumpy in other people's eyes, and I think the same is probably the case once you get above a certain age. </p> <p>The thing with 'dated' is that shapes and colors and silhouettes come back, and when you're younger or you have an arty style things can be ironically cool, whereas if the rest of your appearance doesn't suggest that, there are no clues to say to others whether you bought those pleated trousers last week or have had them in your closet since the 80s. </p> <p>Thistle, I think there's a kernel of truth in what you say about office appropriateness, particularly in more conservative areas of the world. Teenagers are very sensitive about brands and shapes, often without knowing exactly how to explain what they see, because they haven't yet seen trends come and go for decades. I suspect most of us who have been around a bit longer are more - I'm not sure if tolerant is the right word, or what - ok with ambitiousness about silhouette and color. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876454 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 03:33:58 +0000 Sarah A 876454@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>A great read! Thanks Peri for starting the thread. My frumpy-iest period consisted of one particular uniform: polo shirt, wool pleated high waisted pants purged from MIL closet, Blundstone black or brown work shoes. So, a combination of poor fitting, particularly cut items even though I was in my twenties and thin = frumptastic. Yeah for YLF and everything I have learned here </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876424 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 02:58:00 +0000 Anonymous 876424@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Thank you Shevia, she is quite embarrased about it, actually. she wanted something more " brainy". </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876413 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 02:51:31 +0000 Isabel 876413@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>When it comes to frumpy, I feel a bit like the Supreme Court on porn : I know it when I see it. LOL </p> <p>I think that frumpy needs more than one item. So if one wore certain shoes with a certain sweater, that might be frumpy but maybe not one piece with more modern items. Maybe ? </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876408 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 02:47:10 +0000 Jaime 876408@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Well everyone has made excellent points. Frump is in the eye of the beholder, but also very connected to who is wearing what and with which intent. I think ruling out entire stores or categories like corporate dress is part of the excess of youth. Zap if you are reading that is amazing about your daughter - the apple doesn't fall far from the tree! </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really/page/2#post-876280 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 01:27:10 +0000 Echo 876280@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I agree about joyless dressing; putting clothes on only to cover one's body. I don't think personal taste comes into things quite as much, since there are a LOT of styles that I don't like that I don't consider frumpy.</p> <p>What has been alluded to but not said outright is the relation of weight and age to frump. I think that a woman carrying extra weight (myself included right now) needs to step it up a notch in order to NOT be considered frumpy. In other words, Janet Reno could have worn the exact same suit as Condoleezza Rice; which one would almost everyone have considered frumpy? Same clothes, different body, different perceptions of style or lack thereof. I don't LIKE it that things are that way, but it is undeniable to me that they are. </p> <p>Since some recent medical issues, I am carrying more weight than is average for me, and I am doubting my style much more than I ever did. I can't put almost anything on and look "fine" anymore; I have to look nice now in order to look fine, if that makes any sense. Part of that is surely my own insecurity, but part of it plays a large part in how many people perceive frump, which is also part of the reason middle aged and older women are more often considered frumpy. A 20 year old woman can wear sweats and flip flops. She may be considered lazy or overly casual or lots of other things, but few people perceive that young woman as frumpy. Put 20 pounds and 20 years on her with the exact same outfit and suddenly she is frumptastic. So part of it definitely is age/body related. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-876214 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 00:25:57 +0000 Peri 876214@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Thank you for all the answers! Wonderful discussion! </p> <p>It seems like the real answer is that there isn't one...which is actually a little comforting. I don't have to be so concerned about someone's judgement because it is so much opinion based. I like the answer that calling someone frumpy says more about the speaker than the accused!</p> <p>I think I'm going to try to use Angie's happiness factor as a kinder and better guide than worrying about whether someone will call me frumpy. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-876207 Wed, 13 Mar 2013 00:21:20 +0000 Suz 876207@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Fascinating discussion. I do not think I have anything much to add but I wanted to thank you, Peri, for raising the subject and giving us an opportunity to think about it. After reading everyone's thoughts I feel even further from a full understanding of what frumpy might be! My online dictionary shows us why: </p> <p>Frumpy: dowdy, frumpish, unfashionable, old-fashioned; drab, dull, homely, shabby, scruffy. ANTONYMS fashionable</p> <p>Well, this encompasses ALL the things various people have been saying. So no wonder we can't entirely agree. </p> <p>I do think that teenage girls have their own style parameters that don't necessarily apply to those of us who are a bit older. I also think that -- much as I love them and the energy they bring to fashion -- they are not NECESSARILY the best arbiters of true style. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875994 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 21:07:04 +0000 Mia 875994@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>From the urban dictionary:</p> <p>A female with lack of concern for appearance. Often characterized by sweatpants, frizzy hair, gramma panties and a pasty complexion.</p> <p>I have frizzy hair all the time but hopefully not all four at once. Oh, wait a second.<br /> Lol </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875985 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 20:55:14 +0000 Astrid 875985@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Very interesting how different the term can be defined. When I do use 'frumpy' when I ask about possible clothes or outfits I mean 'altbacken'. That's one translation the dictionary gives me for 'frumpy'. The other is 'ohne jeden Schick' which means 'without any chic at all'. And 'altbacken' can be translated as 'frumpy' and 'dowdy'. Maybe dowdy is the better term for what I'm normally asking for... </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875983 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 20:47:43 +0000 Anonymous 875983@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I don't think corporate equals frumpy. I do wear fairly corporate attire but I add a little amount of incospicuous flair, it can be in my shoes, the way I do my hair etc. My goal is to add some individuality that can only be seen when is not there. I don't think anyone has ever called me frumpy.</p> <p>Also, frumpy depends on where you are and who your crew is. I cannot go back to Colombia wearing oversized clothes because loose tops = frumpy. Rita cannot go to a Russian banquet wearing a below the knee loose fitting dress = frumpy. </p> <p>Side note : My stylish 18 year old - just voted best dressed senior btw, has gotten things from Ann Taylor, Banana Republic and all of the " frumpy stores". I see lots of young women buying items from frumpville. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875978 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 20:42:02 +0000 RoseandJoan 875978@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>To me frumpy is joyless dressing, dated can show an enthusiasm for a style gone by but frumpy appears to take no pleasure in clothing aside from the practical element of covering ones body.</p> <p>One frumpy item does not equal frumpy style IMO.</p> <p>By this definition a teenager may find AT frumpy if they would gain no joy from wearing the clothes. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875967 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 20:29:10 +0000 Gaylene 875967@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>interesting discussion here.</p> <p>Defining "frumpy" as the "absence of style" is questionable. Is the perceived "absence" a reflection of my not adhering to your sensibilities as to what is stylish? As for the other definitions, exactly how does an outside observer determine the degree of "stylish intent" or "lack of caring"? If I'm a fashion blogger, hectic pattern mixing is stylish, but, if I'm homeless, it's something else? And if shapelessness becomes the critical factor, does that mean that figure flattery is all important?</p> <p>I think I'm sticking with my contention that calling something "frumpy" says more about the commentator's sensibilities than the outfit. If the comment comes from someone who has expertise, it might have some value, but I'd still need an understandable follow-up that articulated more precisely what was not working. Otherwise a label like "frumpy" is nothing more than an inarticulate negative judgement--best handled with a response like "whatever". </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875964 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 20:26:20 +0000 jayne 875964@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I have been frumpy, didn't have a clue how to dress, didn't care to try since I was pretty overweight.</p> <p>I am not frump anymore. I have clothes that fit, I pick colors that flatter and I accessorize (maybe too much). I don't follow what the others in my age group wear to work or out, and I try to avoid stores that seem somehow not following any trends. I think a hint of modern and a hint of a trend is needed, but not overboard of course! </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875910 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:36:09 +0000 4babiesMe 875910@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Interesting thread. To me, when I think about "frumpy" I think of the days (and there have been way too many for me in the last 7 years) where I just don't care or make any effort to put myself together. To me, it's throwing on my old, ill-fitting, stained sweatshirt, jeans, yoga pants, or DH's t-shirts and not giving a second thought to style. It's also not putting any effort in doing my hair &amp; makeup. To me, it's the appearance of not caring. I definitely think "frumpy" has a different meaning for everyone. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875909 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:35:48 +0000 Mo 875909@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Thistle, I have to respectfully disagree. I'd say Janet Reno dressed frumpily, but totally office appropriate. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875905 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:32:22 +0000 catgirl 875905@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>How does the Man Repeller fit into this (the idea being that men would find her high fashion looks repelling)? Is frump in the eye of the beholder?</p> <p>I know women who consider my refusal to show cleavage a form of frumpiness, or at least stodgy in some way. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875896 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:27:54 +0000 Thistle 875896@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Frumpy = appropriate office wear based on this definition. </p> <p>Sorry, but it's true. When you are in High School or college you can wear ripped denim and short skirts and its okay. You do it in the office, and your boss has a sit down with you. If it is too egregious, you get sent home to change. And is that really how you want to be known in your office? </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875891 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:24:48 +0000 Anonymous 875891@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I agree with Ironkurtin. Frumpiness is the absence of style. It's looking like you have no clue how to put an outfit together. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875884 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:21:02 +0000 rachylou 875884@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Eh, well I don't want to upset anyone, but I <em>would</em> say AT, WHBM, and Talbots <em>stores</em> are frumpy, but the clothing isn't really. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875880 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:18:44 +0000 ironkurtin 875880@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>To me frumpy is different than dated. Dated means you're wearing an outdated silhouette or style. Frumpy is never HAVING a style. It's shapelessness without stylish intent. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875838 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 18:41:26 +0000 Mo 875838@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I think frumpy is a viable, useful word, if maybe it does also have negative connotations. I also think what is frumpy to a 20 year old may be smashing, of the moment, to a 50 year old. That's okay and it actually makes sense. We often remark about dressing appropriately for one's age and so it would follow that what you find appropriate at 20 is very different than what your eye sees as pleasing 30 years later. Perhaps the young ladies referred to in the post are replacing conservative with frumpy unwittingly. I consider all the above named stores conservative, and I'm 43. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875829 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 18:36:54 +0000 milehighstyle (Linda) 875829@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I think it's the total package rather than the individual item. Every example I think of that could be a frumpy item or look I've seen styled somewhere in a cool way. But since 75% of my wardrobe is from Ann Taylor I probably am not the one to answer this question </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/what-is-frumpy-really#post-875817 Tue, 12 Mar 2013 18:25:31 +0000 Gaylene 875817@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>It seems to me that the term "frumpy" can mean anything from "how long ago did you buy that?", to "not what I'd choose to wear", to "that doesn't look good on you", and several points in between. I've been thinking about this term after reading the responses to my thread on trends vs. personal style and here's my current thoughts: </p> <p>Labeling something, or someone, as "frumpy", "trying too hard" , or any other disparaging term, is just another way of expressing a personal bias; it's a judgmental statement that actually says more about the speaker than what is being judged. And it can result in a narrow type of thinking that makes older women feel that Zara is a "young person's store" and teenagers think that BR is an "old person's store". </p> <p>I think a more useful term when it comes to assessing a person's style or outfit might be "dated" since it's easier to describe more precisely why a particular cut or silhouette might not be working as well now as it did in the past. A "dated" look could still work, especially if the person was young and the item was worn in an ironic way. On an older body, though, a "dated" look may not have that ironic connotation and the intentionality would be lost. </p>