https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019 Style Advice for Fashion Lovers en-US Thu, 16 Apr 2026 12:58:02 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/search.php https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2138548 Fri, 14 Aug 2020 20:58:06 +0000 AngieB 2138548@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Kari, I feel you, I hear, and I speak up and often. I used to be a size 30\32, a number that offered little more than carpet remnants and upholstery fabric fashioned into a tent because bigger people must be punished. I'm now a 14, and while retail fashion is now within my grasp, I'm still being punished for not being a single-digit size. The truth is not about serving the market, because a majority of American women are a plus size. The truth is that it's just discrimination -- the oldest story there is. Progress was being made in the last few years, and now it seems to have regressed. I have sent countless letters and emails to retailers over the years, calling this out, and I shall continue to do so. Carry on, sister! </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2137963 Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:23:52 +0000 Tina 2137963@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p><div>Kari,</div><div>I'm standing up and applauding. Nothing for me at the NAS, in part because of the lack of plus size options and in part because the pandemic has lead to a total lack of need for anything new. (I usually buy shoes at the sale if nothing else -- but I'm not wearing shoes!)</div><div><br /></div> </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2137864 Tue, 11 Aug 2020 15:48:52 +0000 karen13 2137864@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Kari- thank you for sharing this information, Your willingness to speak up in the face of push back and your thoughtful commentary have helped me better recognize this widespread and socially accepted prejudice in myself and others. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2136754 Tue, 04 Aug 2020 11:46:06 +0000 Anonymous 2136754@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I didn't really look that hard at NAS offerings, but it's really a shame that Nordstrom, and many other shops, ignore such a big potential market- both petite and plus. </p> <p>But- I just saw that Peruvian Connection is now offering some things in 2x, so it's a start. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2136707 Tue, 04 Aug 2020 01:55:34 +0000 Nadya 2136707@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>MsMary ❤️</p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2136665 Mon, 03 Aug 2020 17:09:16 +0000 MsMary 2136665@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I had a long post about sexism and fatphobia but it's just too upsetting. So I'll just say I agree with Kari and completely disagree that there's not a market for large size fashionable clothes. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2136579 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 22:12:51 +0000 christieanne 2136579@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I haven't been posting on YLF for a long time (but I recognize some names....and hope you are well!) but came here specifically after checking out the Nordstrom A Sale preview.&nbsp;<br />I put one item in my wish list. ONE. And it is a jacket in a style I already have in a different shade. There is nothing else desirable for Plus. No career tops or skirts (or non black pants!).&nbsp;<br />As a career retailer, I know how tough the business is. Trust me. However Nordstrom has been eliminating plus in brick and mortar stores for a couple of years. And now my own dept store chain is set to eliminate with petites or plus in a large percent of stores. We can't figure out why - sales are equally good in both arras.&nbsp;</p> <p>Thank you Kari for calling this out. As lines switch to a supposedly extended size format, the options will become worse and worse. So the market will dry up. It is very bad for long range business scenarios.&nbsp; </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2136570 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 20:18:57 +0000 Sal 2136570@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Thanks for sharing that article - it nails the prejudice out there in the market and in opinions. </p> <p>I hope you are doing okay Kari- I imagine these threads feel worthwhile on one hand and so challenging and difficult on the other. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2136553 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 18:27:47 +0000 Suz 2136553@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>That InStyle piece is great, <b>Carla</b> -- thanks.&nbsp;</p> <p>And <b>UmmLila </b>-- that's hilarious!!&nbsp; </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/3#post-2136535 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 17:02:04 +0000 UmmLila (Lisa) 2136535@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Emme and I were in the same girl scout troop, back in the day.&nbsp;<br />And you can follow her on Insta, if you so choose.<br />That InStyle article is good. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136525 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 15:58:30 +0000 Janet 2136525@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>That article is so on point, Carla. It’s so true, and I’ve become more and more aware of how much BS it is lately. I have seen outfits praised as “chic” on slender women that would be panned on someone heavier. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136520 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 13:56:20 +0000 Preppy Pear 2136520@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I certainly remember the Emme line! In my early twenties, I had a pair of pants, a skirt and a top that I spent to what to me was a fortune at the time on, and wore those pieces to death. I was a student and couldn’t really afford it, but it was so worth it. Those were great clothes - beautiful and stylish, and I remember feeling so pretty in the dressing room compared to just wishing and hoping any xl/16 bottoms would fit me at the GAP, which didn’t. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136501 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 04:38:48 +0000 annagybe 2136501@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Great article Carla. Ive seen a few different takes on that pic, but that author did good </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136491 Sun, 02 Aug 2020 03:05:27 +0000 Carla 2136491@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I understand the frustration. &nbsp;I may wear straight sizes, but my mother and sister don’t - and their struggle to be stylish is real. &nbsp;</p> <p><a rel="nofollow" href="https://www.instyle.com/fashion/fashion-trends-still-only-for-skinny-bodies">https://www.instyle.com/fashio.....nny-bodies</a></p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136431 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 17:27:19 +0000 annagybe 2136431@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I really don't need much, but yeah their plus size offerings the last few years have been crap.<br />I remember way back in 2000-2001, they got Emme's plus size line.<br />She was the first plus size superodel<br /><a rel="nofollow" href="https://www.emmestyle.com/">https://www.emmestyle.com/</a><br />Apparently she has some clothes now, but not like before.<br />Anyways I got this awesome zebra coat with hot pink lining from Nordstrom. I got rid of it when I was skinny, and now am regretting it.&nbsp;<br />I remember when Good American came to Nordstrom, Khloe Kardashian pushed to have alllll the sizes in the same section. Yes the Kardashians are problematic, but I have to applaud her development of the line. But by last year that section in the downtown Flagship store in Seattle shrunk and shrunk.<br />Before the pandemic, Nordstorm I believe had the retail power to make brands expand their sizing. But I never really saw it. <br />Probably over 80% of the clothes on second floor which is designer and SPACE, emerging designers, are not above a size 12, let alone a 14. Lafayette is very nice, but also very classic.<br />Absolutely anything really interesting in the sale, isn't anywhere near my current size.&nbsp;<br />For example I like this top, but the XL is equal to a 12. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136428 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 17:06:43 +0000 Aquamarine 2136428@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>This is disappointing. Everyone is so eloquent and I feel embarrassed to admit I was under the impression we were making progress. I follow Wardrobe Oxygen and The Mom Edit, which has a plus-sized member who recently gave her NAS picks, too, but perhaps as you say, Kari, I am too privileged to recognize the actual dearth of plus-sized options at NAS and elsewhere.</p> <p>I do think calling out stores strategically on social media makes more of an impact than writing a letter, based on personal experience. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136427 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 16:47:30 +0000 JAileen 2136427@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I don’t understand why Nordstrom is ignoring an entire section of the population. &nbsp;There’s money to be made there. &nbsp;My son’s GF is young, hip, and plus size. &nbsp;It’s definitely hard to find gifts for her. &nbsp;How many scarves does a young woman need? </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136404 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 07:39:20 +0000 Lucy 2136404@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Thanks for raising this issue ! As an Australian , I don’t shop at Nordies but the situation is just as dire here, if not more so. It’s completely baffling to me that at the very moment when retail is struggling , shops are also not servicing the majority of women .<br /> It is even more irritating when some are claiming to be more inclusive and yet they are not ! </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136403 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 06:55:55 +0000 Barbara Diane 2136403@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I also was shocked to see how few items there were to choose from.</p> <p>OTOH I find the quality has really dropped the last few years, so I rarely find clothing I like at Nordstrom anymore. There are usually some better items that are considerably more expensive than I can afford and do not fit my life. </p> <p>In the last several years my store expanded, added a restaurant, eliminated my department, and then replaced the good quality items with dreck.</p> <p>When I find better quality at Talbots Outlet something is wrong. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136394 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 03:34:44 +0000 Nadya 2136394@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p><b>Kari</b>, I am also very disappointed in this year’s offering. And even more than the limited number of items, I am frustrated by the blandness of it all. There are 13 pairs of plus pants in the sale. Half of them are black, and even more have a black option. You know what every single plus size retailer makes for plus size women? &nbsp;Black pants. I was frankly disappointed by the offerings from the brand Angie recently shared, because their catalog was also full of the same few basics I can find everywhere. Ditto another newish brand, Ryllace.</p> <p>I see the same pattern in dresses and tops at NAS. I’m sure this year is pared back because so many of us are more casual these days. But how can fashion brighten our days and tempt our wallets when nothing new is offered?</p> <p> <div>As others have said in different ways, fashion is run by humans and human bias often drives far more decisions than does logic. This systemic lack of choice is not simply because there’s no money to be made. </p> <p>From a recent <a rel="nofollow" href="https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/26/fashion/everlane-employees-ethical-clothing.html">NY Times article about Everlane</a> </p> <p><i>For instance, Everlane was criticized for not providing extended sizing across its line and </i><a rel="nofollow" href="https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/clarissajanlim/everlane-jeans-shopping-plus-sizes"><i>in stores</i></a><i>, despite releasing ads with curvy models and saying </i><a rel="nofollow" href="https://www.vox.com/2017/12/20/16797310/fashion-innovation-plus-size-lacking"><i>for years</i></a><i>&nbsp;that this was on their “road map.” But inside the company, the attitude toward plus-size shoppers was even more explicitly dismissive.</i></p> <p>“<i>It was not on the road map because it was not aspirational to be fat,” said a former employee, a web designer who had worked at Everlane since before it sold its first T-shirt. “Everything at the company at that time had to be aspirational.”</i></p> <p> </div></p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136393 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 03:24:09 +0000 Echo 2136393@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Size limitation in retail is NOT a supply and demand thing. As has been stated before, one cannot sell what one does not have or even seek to carry. And then for Nordstrom to praise themselves for being size-inclusive when they are exactly the opposite is disingenuous and a slap in the face to ALL customers. Size bias is very real, not only in fashion, but in everyday life, and as Zapotee mentioned, the struggle being small or tall or whatever else is NOT the same; it doesn't even compare.&nbsp;When someone brings a very real and hurtful issue, the proper response is not, "But look! I have a problem, too!"&nbsp;</p> <p>I have not always responded in an empathetic way to Kari's posts. I didn't have the proper information to do so, but I've informed myself and I know better. It takes a tremendous amount of courage and fortitude to bring these issues before an audience of primarily straight-sized peers, and I have so much respect for Kari for continuing to do so. I will be contacting Nordstrom. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136392 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 02:57:51 +0000 UmmLila (Lisa) 2136392@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I tend to think that businesses, and particularly retailers in harder economic times, are disinclined to do anything they view as financially risky. Change is a risk. Some businesses have been making changes in the face of the BLM protests. Perhaps it’s cynical, but I don’t think businesses are suddenly waking up and realizing it’s time to be decent. I think they are worried about either their revenues or their stock prices. </p> <p>I think the focus of Karie’s original post is around how to convince Nordstrom,<br /> as a retailer, to be decent. However, to achieve lasting change, they have to see it as good for business. </p> <p>How can non-straight sized women do this, when there is so little opportunity to vote with their resources, so hard to find and patronize the merchants that cater to their needs?</p> <p>One way really requires research and big data: developing a report that shows what is the money left on the table, or spent on other things, by women who can’t find what they like in most stores? </p> <p>A less data intensive thing could be forming a coalition of women of all sizes to have one day to buy from a designated merchant(s) that have demonstrated a commitment to size-inclusiveness ... and tracking what that kind of shopping looks like. And perhaps committing to not buy from uninclusive merchants in the same week. </p> <p>A final idea that’s Nordstrom-focused. They seem to like getting fashion bloggers to do small collections. Perhaps they could be pressed to do a high quality, well done micro collection with a blogger or celebrity who isn’t straight sized, and if supporters ensure it sells out, that could be a lesson in being more supportive of customers of all sizes. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136390 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 02:10:41 +0000 featherwitch 2136390@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>As someone who straddles a XL/16/XXL/14W/16W depending on the item, Kari, thank you for bringing this to the forefront. I really have to shop hard for things that fit, and fit well. I'm not looking for a tent-like fit, thank-you-very-much.&nbsp;</p> <p>I still have some Sejour and Classiques Entier items in my closet; they're in fantastic shape and have withstood regular wear, several years of trends, and survived many closet edits.&nbsp;</p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136387 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 01:49:37 +0000 ZoeyGirl 2136387@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Kari, I also thank you for bringing this conversation. I am informed about this topic, thanks to you, and would also like to stand with you as an advocate for change. I would be happy to copy and paste your data in my own email to Nordstrom’s customer service, if you would be ok with me using your research for that purpose.&nbsp;</p> <div><br /></div><div>Thank you again.<br /></div></p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136384 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 00:47:46 +0000 Kari 2136384@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>But the thing is, Nordstrom isn’t sticking to anything. They are claiming to already be way more size inclusive when for the past few years, way before COVID, that’s simply not true. It was the same scenario in 2019, only not quite as bad because their sale overall had more pieces offered.<br /> It’s also the case for many plus size brands that refuse to expand their offerings above a 24 or 26W, and instead decide to target customers who are sizes 10-12. Later, I’ll see if I can find some links, but this conversation is really exhausting. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136383 Sat, 01 Aug 2020 00:34:15 +0000 Anonymous 2136383@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Yes . This is all very true . But now that retailer is dealing with merchandise that may never have left China before shipping stopped , or was going to be delayed leaving China and thus cancelled by the retailer. Then there is the retailer dealing with unforeseen and untenable loss of sales , and unable/unwilling to assume that sales for the July sale ( in Nordstrom’s case) would be there to support the initial buy . If I were a merchandise planner/buyer , I’d not be willing to bet on anything other than guaranteed sales right now . Not the time to be sticking to promises to expand size ranges or support untapped markets . It’s the unpleasant reality of buying right now . </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136377 Fri, 31 Jul 2020 23:09:27 +0000 aly 2136377@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Kari, I don't speak up much but just want to say thank you for consistently bringing this issue to our attention. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136365 Fri, 31 Jul 2020 22:22:48 +0000 Angie 2136365@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I'm chiming in again to tag onto what <b>Jenava </b>and<b> Suz</b> said, which takes me back to data and retail's misuse of it.&nbsp;</p> <p>The most BOUGHT sizes in the US <i>are not the same</i> as the most popular sizes of US women. The most bought sizes are smaller - US6 to 10 when the average size of the US woman is around US16 to 18. In other words, sales are much higher in straight sizes than in plus sizes. That is the economic premise for "going after the money".</p> <p>That's NOT accurate data, and it needs a big shake up.&nbsp;</p> <p>Sales are higher in straight sizes because of the ample supply of them, which the NAS demonstrates in the numbers that <b>Kari</b> pulled together. <u>Larger sizes can't buy something that isn't there!!! </u>I have been shouting that from the rooftops forever!</p> <p>You can't show high sales in plus sizes when there isn't the assortment to support the potential buying pattern. Fair is fair, and the assortments are skewed toward straight sizes. The availability of fab stuff in larger sizes is in extreme short supply, and it's spiraling downwards because the mis-represented data is being followed. Unless there is CHANGE in the merchandise size scales to reflect a more accurate representation of the female size demographic in the US, sales numbers will continue to support straight sizes.&nbsp;</p> <p>I have been an advocate for size inclusivity for a very long time - way before YLF. I started a plus size department at a retailer abroad back in the '90s because I saw an under supplied retail segment (I was a specialist retail buyer at the time). The need was so dire, that the items flew out of stores and I could not keep the department adequately stocked!&nbsp;</p> <p>When we visited Karen Kane 9 years ago in CA, I asked Karen Kane herself to service larger sizes more deeply because the retail segment is in hectic need of a more fabulous assortment of items in that size range. I went into their sample room and said THIS and THIS and THIS up to 4XL. PLEASE!&nbsp; They actually took my conversation to heart and tapped the market, making more and more gorgeous plus sized samples. They now supply a lot of plus sized merchandise.</p> <p>And last, <b>Kari</b>, I wrote this about Nordstrom on YLF last year. It laments our beloved and very size inclusive house brands that were discontinued. It circulated Nordstrom head office. I don't know if I had an impact, but I did put some wheels in motion:&nbsp;</p> <p><a rel="nofollow" href="https://youlookfab.com/2019/09/04/nordstrom-remember-your-roots/">https://youlookfab.com/2019/09.....our-roots/</a> </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136350 Fri, 31 Jul 2020 21:06:04 +0000 Jenava 2136350@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I have to challenge the idea that this is a result of Nordies "going where the money is".&nbsp; As someone who actually worked on their size scales for their merchants, the key here is "you are what you eat".&nbsp; In other words, if they don't buy those sizes, their customers won't have them to buy.&nbsp; So how will they know what the size of that market is?&nbsp; I can tell you, the process was NOT as scientific as you might think.&nbsp; Of course, if the brand they are buying doesn't offer that size, then that is a limitation.&nbsp; But there is nothing stopping those merchants from seeking out brands with wider size options.&nbsp; Of course, that does take more work that just going back to the same well. Not to mention, they have NPG at their disposal, which will produce whatever they want.</p> <p>Just anecdotally, I would expect the larger size market to be bigger than the 00 market.&nbsp; Especially in the south and midwest where Nordies is quite popular.</p> <p>There is a lower margin, likely, since it requires more fabric.&nbsp; But that seems like a negligible point since other brands seem to be navigating this market segment successfully.&nbsp; I think the original idea of getting rid of Sejour and other "plus" NPG brands was to fold those sizes in to the "regular" (UGH) size scales.&nbsp; My guess is a combination of lack of know-how and what was "always done" on the part of the merchants, and gaps in technology with their tools, subverted that shift, along with the simple lack of brands around that carry this broader range and also have a the right quality/volume and a style that appeals.&nbsp; This latter issue seems to me to be more a lack of interest by merchants, though.&nbsp; And that I think is something that straight sized folks can make a fuss about to Nordies.&nbsp; I, too, have become less thrilled with what's on offer lately and now this...I am quickly looking towards sustainable and inclusive brands that represent my values...and I am not seeing those brands carried at Nordstrom.&nbsp; Very sad.</p> <p>I, too, would be VERY interested to hear what a Nordies buyer had to say - particularly of NPG lines that Nordies itself controls. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/nas-for-plus-sizes-worse-than-2019/page/2#post-2136329 Fri, 31 Jul 2020 18:39:31 +0000 Suz 2136329@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I guess what's most disappointing (well, I mean apart from the unavailability of the clothing itself) is the disjunct between what retailers <b>pretend</b> to be doing/ offering and what they <b>actually</b> offer/ do. In the past, larger bodies were completely invisible in fashion. Now they are a bit more visible, so people imagine they are being served -- yet they are being <b>less</b> served, not more.&nbsp;</p> <p>What's interesting is that marketers see a reason to try to appeal to this group -- and then the actual offerings don't carry it through. I like <b>Jules'</b>s suggestion (not that I'm on Insta). But I think if it's about false images we have to talk to the image-makers. It might also be really useful and interesting for teachers to bring this up in schools, to make it a research project for kids.&nbsp;</p> <p><b>Jules</b>, I hear you on the kids' clothing issue. What a shame. Why do all the retailers who are genuinely trying seem to be the ones who go under? (I know that's not entirely true but it sometimes feels that way...)&nbsp;</p> <p> </p>