https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies Style Advice for Fashion Lovers en-US Mon, 27 Apr 2026 08:15:14 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/search.php https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-405092 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 19:08:38 +0000 Elly 405092@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>There have been a lot of great points brought up here. </p> <p>Modesty seems to be a bit of a hot-button issue here. Of course, this surprised me at first since I often see the word used on the site, specifically when Angie asks us to chose teams or describe our styles and the motivations behind those choices. Of course, I did ask what modesty meant to *you.* </p> <p>I certainly agree that culture impacts what the word "modesty" means, as well as how we see fashion and even concepts like feminism. </p> <p>In my community, feminism is much maligned. However, there has been support for indigenous feminism. The focus is different, more on the health of the whole community. It allows more room for cultural and traditional beliefs about both the power and strength and roles of women. </p> <p>Taylor and Elizabeth, I particularly appreciated how you approached the issue. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-405001 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 16:09:10 +0000 Aziraphale 405001@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Aw, thanks, Janet. :-)</p> <p>It's nice to hear votes of support on this divisive topic. There was an interesting article on fashion and feminism last Friday on Sal's link page. It's related to this comment thread. I'll try to remember to suggest it for Angie's lovely links post, but here it is for now:</p> <p><a href="http://finalfashion.ca/so-is-fashion-feminist/" rel="nofollow">http://finalfashion.ca/so-is-fashion-feminist/</a> </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404896 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 13:09:24 +0000 Sona 404896@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Una- I totally agree- modesty is in the mind- of both men and women. To the poster who asked what is India like in terms of fashion and feminism- its hard to define one norm. With the economic boom has come a lot of western/global looks, major designer labels, label envy and many Indian women are now choosing careers in films/f ashion/ televsion . That being said the onus on women to be fair skinned, skinny and tall is huge. This is of course an oxymoron because as a race we are darker skinned, shorter in stature and curvaceous.Unfortunately feminism is still in its infancy and as on another thread ambitious urban women are those that often marry rich and have influential friends.<br /> Yet 70% of India is rural- women work alongside men in fields while tending to hearth and home without any help from men for the most part. BUt globalisation is making its way to villages and cell phones and computers are bringing in waves of literacy and economic empowerment.<br /> It is still in both urban and rural settings very much a male dominated society though. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404889 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 12:40:27 +0000 Janet 404889@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Elisabeth, we need a "like" button for that post. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404835 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 05:25:41 +0000 Aziraphale 404835@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Adorkable (cute name, btw): I understand completely where you're coming from. My figure is on the boyish side, and I can 'get away with' shorter, tighter clothing that a woman with a more va-va-voom figure -- but I agree that it's unfair. </p> <p>About ten years ago, my mom was working as an elementary school secretary, and there was an interesting court case that began with a grade seven student at her school. The young girl in question was full-figured and well-endowed in the cleavage department, and she went to school one day wearing a tank top and was asked by the principal to cover herself with a sweater. Her father was furious, since it was a hot day and most of the other girls -- all of whom were slender and small-breasted -- were wearing similar tank tops. The father insisted that his daughter was being punished for being plump. I don't know how it all turned out, but it went to court. I sort of agree with the dad -- it's an unfair double standard -- but on the other hand, the tank top certainly drew attention to the young girl's voluptuousness, which somehow doesn't seem appropriate for an elementary school setting. Perhaps they should tighten up the dress code for everybody.</p> <p>The other thing that kind of annoys me when the topic of 'modest' dressing comes up is -- and this is another feminist issue -- that why is it the woman's problem if a man cannot restrain himself at the sight of her breasts? I may be going out on a limb here, and I fully agree with all of you who feel that over-the-top 'sexy' clothing is inappropriate for the office; however, some women, owing to their generous cup sizes, often cannot help a little visible cleavage in just about any top that flatters such a figure. Large breasts look better in v-necks and blouses with open collars; high necked tops just make the boobs look even bigger. Why should they feel they need to hide them, as well as any other curves, in the workplace? Grown men should be able to handle seeing the top of a breast without getting all distracted. It's all desensitization, anyway -- like the African women in the movie 'Babies', who stroll around without any top at all and somehow we don't register them as being half-naked.</p> <p>Una: what's India like now in term's of fashion and feminism? </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404829 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 04:47:45 +0000 Briar 404829@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>As it pertains to cleavage (and really any revealing dressing in the workplace or church), I'm with @MsMaven and her DH. </p> <p>If you want to be taken seriously in the workplace, I am pretty conservative and do not believe you should show any cleavage at all. I think it is naive to think others aren't distracted by it, whether men or women. The eye is naturally drawn to skin and men are especially visual. If your colleagues are looking at someone's uncovered chest because their shirt is too low or upper gams because their skirt is too short, then how can they be listening to anyone's ideas? Outside of church and the workplace, I'm fine with less conservative dress for adult women. </p> <p>I've been having a similar conversation with my 14 year old DD about how dressing can attract the right or wrong attention from boys. It's just plain creepy when adult men are straining their neck to look at underage girls with revealing clothing because their parents aren't bold enough to set appropriate boundaries. </p> <p>Last week I was on an airplane and the flight attendant (who had great legs) had on a mid thigh uniform dress. When she reached up to put a bag in the overhead compartment, the dress rose right below her bum and you could see the lines of her pantyhose. It was really unprofessional. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404802 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 03:37:35 +0000 adorkable 404802@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>To jump in:</p> <p>I agree with all the objections to the term. I have particularly strong feelings about this because I have gotten lectures from bosses / parents / professors / men I've dated about the "inappropriateness" of a particular outfit for a particular context, often when a woman who was differently shaped was wearing a significantly more revealing outfit.</p> <p>(I'm 5'3" or so, a size 4-8 depending, and a 30G bra. I'm one of those women who is both slender and curvy, and while I like my body, pretty much anything can look "obscene" if you are of the mindset (which I'm not) that women's bodies are obscene.)</p> <p>I don't show a lot of cleavage, but I wear fairly low-cut shirts because high-cut shirts make me look thick around the middle. I wear tastefully short skirts because I have great legs.</p> <p>But frankly, one of my great feminist pet peeves is the pervasive idea that some bodies are naturally more "obscene" than others, and therefore an outfit that looks "tasteful" on someone boyish might look "trashy" on me. See, for instance: <a href="http://lillianbehrendt.com/?p=50" rel="nofollow">http://lillianbehrendt.com/?p=50</a> </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404777 Mon, 15 Aug 2011 02:53:13 +0000 catgirl 404777@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I agree, Sona - although sometimes in is not in the woman's mind but the man's. I remember being back in Mumbai a couple of decades ago, before India was quite as modern, and getting harassed by guys if I so much as met their eyes, even though I was dressed just like my cousins ("Eve-teasing", if I recall). Either they knew I was foreign-born (which was associated with loose morals) or just daring to stare back was asking for trouble. And the same thing happens here passing by a construction site or even the international hostel across the street from my office - TO ME, a middle-aged mom! </p> <p>And the frustrating thing is that if you were to turn the tables and objectify the guys, most men would find THAT to be suggestive also - because the power dynamic has yet to equalize. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404618 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 23:21:15 +0000 Sona 404618@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Ok I'll start off with what might sound strange but to me someone could be fully clothed in billowing figure hiding robes and yet be immodest. To me: Modesty is more than what you wear its also how you wear it and includes subtle things like body language.<br /> For an appropriate date night I'll occassioanlly wear a low neckline top or a short skirt but when I walk its a confident walk its not a come hither or look at me walk. I find this makes the opposite sex less likely to look at me in an assessing manner.<br /> If you feel immodest in your mind then you are more likely to be perceived as such, modesty like most other things starts in the mind. (Of course, these are just my opinions and perceptions.) </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404552 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 20:21:54 +0000 Anonymous 404552@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>A lady. Love that image Angie. Thanks. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404443 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 14:57:14 +0000 Angie 404443@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>high five, Kim </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404420 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 14:24:48 +0000 Queen Mum 404420@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>love your answer Angie! </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404418 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 14:21:09 +0000 Angie 404418@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I wear my clothes tight enough so that people can see I am a women, and loose and long enough so that people can see I am a lady. I strive to be lady-like :)</p> <p>That being said, I wear volume and hide my waist quite a bit. But I do wear very tight skinny jeans and sleeveless tops and dresses. </p> <p>With my pixie hair, flat shoes, high neckline preferences and few curves, I am not perceived as stereotypically alluring to men and women. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404326 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 07:24:19 +0000 Anonymous 404326@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Oh it's such a tricky one, isn't it. I agree with you all - it's not black and white and it IS all about context.</p> <p> I like to ask myself 'is this outfit classy, elegant or nice?'. If I err on the side of anything then this is the side I want to be on. If I could get mistaken for a prostitute (please distinguish this from being propositioned because a guy is just a dork) then I am in the wrong clothes.</p> <p> I see a lot of teenagers now who wear the latest fashions and many of them look lovely but just as many look very cheap. Such a shame because I think some of them just don't know any better. I often say to my daughter 'elegant, pretty beautiful. Like Audrey Hepburn!' </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404319 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 06:00:16 +0000 taylor 404319@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>The word modest does not offend me as I am a modest dresser.<br /> I am a very slim hour glass so my clothes must fit otherwise my shape is lost . My clothes show that I do have curves, no denying I am a woman, I feel no need to hide that. Nothing too tight, too short, or too low for me.</p> <p>I am only put off by overt sexual ..in your face sort of attire on other women...I don't exactly understand why some women feel it is necessary to over expose themselves to strangers. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-404292 Sun, 14 Aug 2011 05:15:43 +0000 Aziraphale 404292@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Chewy -- a short answer to your question: no, I don't find it odd at all. Think of it this way: a man can stroll around in certain places with the entire top half of his attire missing, and we don't find it inappropriate, but women can't do that (in Western culture, anyway). There are different fashion rules for men and for women, whether we like or agree with them or not. I think it has do with the nature of male sexuality, in that they (men) are in general more visually stimulated by the female form than the other way around. Thus men's fashions display less of the male form than women's do, because part of the driving force behind women's fashions is related to attracting men -- or the "right" kind of man, whatever the woman feels that is. It's not necessarily a carefully thought-out sort of thing, but it helps shape our fashions regardless. This also explains why gay men often wear much more revealing clothing than straight men; they, too, dress for the benefit of other men.</p> <p>ETA: lyn, a good many young men DO shave their chests! It's the new thing (or so my running partner tells me. She's nearly a decade younger than me, and she finds chest hair on a man appalling. So her husband gets rid of his). </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-403410 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 19:55:12 +0000 rae 403410@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I don't see modesty as a feminine issue - perhaps it's a local thing, but here men show 1/2 chests full of hair, wear tight white pants, wear booty shorts, and sport super-tight tees that expose nippleage. They should be held just as accountable for being inappropriate. </p> <p>IMO, when at work, I feel I must keep the cleavage wrapped up - I think I just feel bad because all the men have to be literally wrapped up in ties all day. Who am I to free my boobs at work when they can't show neck?</p> <p>Outside of work, I'd just prefer to not be forced to look at any body part that has the primary function of expressing bodily fluids/waste. This should adequately cover nips, butt cracks, and man/lady parts. No one needs to think about bathroom action when eating dinner/shopping/riding the bus/et al. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-403392 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 19:24:21 +0000 Heather 403392@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>But on the flipside, it is completely acceptable for men to go shirtless (in certain situations). </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-403389 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 19:20:43 +0000 lyn* 403389@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Then men would have to shave their legs. And their chest. ROFL. I can think of a few guys a cocktail dress would NOT look good on. </p> <p>*lol @ mental image* </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies/page/2#post-403388 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 19:18:07 +0000 chewyspaghetti 403388@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Does anyone else think it's odd that a formal and fairly modest outfit for a woman can be short sleeved, show the collarbones, and the lower leg, but that would be totally inappropriate for a man? </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403309 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 18:14:34 +0000 MsMaven 403309@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Appropriate work wear is a topic that really bugs my DH. He asks, "Where am I supposed to look?" He assumes a colleague or client who is deliberately flaunting cleavage or has too many buttons undone is trying to trap him. He takes great pride in maintaining eye contact and never getting caught "looking." He has been a partner in a big CPA firm and now is of counsel in a law firm and the subject has come up every few months in both places.</p> <p>As for me, I do have some inhibitions going back to the way I was raised. I don't like men staring at my cleavage (which gets harder to hide--I do look better with V or open necklines.) I think that I dress in a fairly modest manner for California. When I visit relatives in Utah, however, I often get the evil eye for wearing stuff that goes unnoticed here. Also, I tend to wear more covered up clothing when I go there. (I'm not talking about the Fundies, either.)</p> <p>And on the way home I ask myself, why does modest mean frumpy in certain communities? </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403308 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 18:14:10 +0000 rachylou 403308@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Is it Connecticut where a town has made wearing baggy pants low and showing a bit of your underwear illegal? Is that about modesty? It's something aimed at boys, in any case.</p> <p>I have to say, I don't know what is so exciting about that. I mean, yes, you really really wonder how they get the pants to stay like that, and you really want to pull them up, but I don't see the scandal. I should think bare chest is more blinding than the band of someone's BDs. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403292 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 17:56:33 +0000 Liz 403292@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Diana, I do dress modestly for religious reasons, so I'll give a shot at my answer to your questions. First, there are several ideas associated with the word modest: One is related to bodies and sexuality, others to ideas of arrogance, pride (modest about her accomplishments) , and the ides of ostentation (a modest house in the country). I think the question here is more about bodies and sexuality, and that gets dicey because culture plays such a huge impact -- even for those of us who are religious. I'm probably about as modest as they come, yet my equally religious great-great-grandmothers would probably think I am incredibly immodest. Why? Cultural norms have changed. I can be modest in my culture by wearing what would have been immodest in theirs. The same goes when you switch cultures. I remember the story of some US missionaries who were in a country where the women were naked from the waist up. The missionaries were scandalized. Yet they later learned the people in that country were scandalized by them, because the missionary women wore dresses that showed their legs from the knee down -- and legs were incredibly immodest.<br /> So while there are commonsense guidelines (particularly for what's appropriate in different settings) hard and fast rules are nearly impossible -- and somewhat useless. Not to mention that "meaningless" rules without reason or heart are one of the things that have turned so many people away from religion. </p> <p>But there is also something very intangible here, which makes any prescription for "this is modest / this isn't" nearly impossible.<br /> think modesty is incredibly hard to talk about, because the word shifts from culture to culture, and from historical time period within cultures. What most people are really talking about are questions of sexuality. And there's a blunt truth that when you get used to seeing a lot of skin, it looses its sexual impact. (Witness: old novels I've read that talk about a tantalizing glimpse of a "trim foot" or "delicate ankle.") I'm remembering some young women I was once around. They were from an extremely religiously conservative family -- so conservative they boggled my mind, and I thought I was from a religiously conservative background! But here's what blew me away: These sisters exuded sex. They weren't showing cleavage or baring skin, they weren't voluptuous or particularly curvy, but there was nothing modest about them. And every guy around them picked up on it. I don't know if they had no idea what was happening, or if they knew exactly what they were doing. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403255 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 17:19:02 +0000 Suz 403255@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>With you, Mary K. My body actually looks better than it did 20 years ago. Maybe better than it EVER did! And while I'm not going to win any casting calls for Mad Men (my up top proportions will prevent that!) I'm happy with the way I look and feel now and would like to enjoy different styles and even perhaps show off a wee bit, especially since I spent my 20s dressing super-conservatively, largely out of a fear of calling attention to myself. </p> <p>Given my height, I actually think that skirts above the knee are a really good look. I like to bare my arms. I don't have any cleavage to speak of, so it's not a problem (LOL, Saretta - same issue here!). </p> <p>I think in the end the real issue is dressing appropriately for the situation we are in. Of course our culture will dictate, to a degree, what's "appropriate" which is why we sometimes see generational differences—there's a way in which the different generations are part of different cultures, or different subcultures, at least. Having been away from fashion for so long, I discover that some of the new trends simply don't appeal to me. If I analyze this, in some cases it's an instinctive recognition that those trends would not look good on the body I had (and might or might not look good on the body that I now HAVE; class high vamp booties or shoes in that category). In other cases, it's because I grew up believing those looks were "tarty" (class high heels with shorts in that category; I just can't get used to the look—I mean for ME, personally; it is fine for others who are comfortable with it.) </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403240 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 17:00:58 +0000 Di 403240@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Diana: I'm not sure how to define it, either. I know that on *me,* I worry that things being form-fitting (even if there's fabric over every bit of skin, and nothing's "tight") is considered immodest, but I don't think that's a general thing. </p> <p>It's such a tender subject, too, because (as I talked about last week), I think our definition of modesty depends hugely on body type, and we can be enormously judgmental in that way. Truly, I think that's unfair on both sides: busty women who aren't looking for comments about being "sexy," and more rectangular women who want their sexuality to be acknowledged. </p> <p>Maybe, ultimately, the ideal has less to do with modesty (as defined by our cleavage, curves, or legs), and more to do with always presenting ourselves with both confidence and respect. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403238 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 16:59:54 +0000 Queen Mum 403238@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>and how many of us want to see a man walking around in short tight shorts with his dilly hanging out? Is it really only women who society places expectations of modest dress on? </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403234 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 16:55:37 +0000 MsMary 403234@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>This is an interesting topic for me. I was overweight and trying to cover up for most of my life, and now that I'm at a size and shape I'm happy with, I have to worry about being age-appropriate. (Although I know I have the proverbial funny way of showing it! LOL)</p> <p>I concur that the concept of "modesty" is and has been used to oppress women. I tend to twitch at the idea that it's up to a woman to cover herself because men can't be expected to control themselves. But I have a friend who has coverted to a religion that practices very modest dress and she seems to be very happy. So on the other hand, I think who am I to question her choice?</p> <p>Me personally, I just try not to look too horrifying. I wear above-the-knee skirts but not mini's. I wear short shorts on the weekend, but generally not out in public. I try not to display my aging cleavage. And I make sure my wrap dresses wrap ALL the way around so I don't show too much thigh or undies. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403230 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 16:52:08 +0000 lyn* 403230@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Ah, the grocery store. </p> <p>Even my pseudo-5 year old said "EWWWWWW." when a woman walked in with a TINY bikini top and short shorts. </p> <p>I concur with Queen Mum, it does depend on where you see it! That tiny bikini top is not modest for the context... even a 5 year old knows. Given she's my pseudo-5 yr old.</p> <p>(she's really 5. She's just pseudo-mine.) </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403229 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 16:49:11 +0000 Queen Mum 403229@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>lyn... please tell your friend thank you for us :-)</p> <p>I do think that when considering appropriate dress, the society that we live in plays a huge role. For instance, Lyn's friend would be right at home with a tribe in the jungles of Africa, but here in the states, it just wouldn't be considered appropriate. </p> <p>I remember watching the film "Babies" a while back. It was interesting to me that every time they showed the African women walking around nude I didn't think a thing of it, but the one time the screen showed the American woman getting out of the hot tub (I think) and showing some nudity, I cringed inside. I cannot articulate exactly why, but obviously, the societal context played a huge role in my interpretation.</p> <p>Don't shoot me... I'm just telling you my experience.</p> <p>And I think these are the same reasons we think nothing of seeing cleavage and tummies at the beach, but really don't need to see them in more "civilized" settings, like work, church, and even the grocery store. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/modesty-society-and-bodies#post-403224 Fri, 12 Aug 2011 16:43:03 +0000 Diana 403224@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Fruitful and Di: I agree with you about not particularly liking or identifying with the word "modest". To me it implies a certain type of submissive repression, usually religious. Although I personally haven't felt any pressure to be modest in that sense, I also don't want to be seen as meek or submissive, particularly when I have no religious or other reason for doing so. </p> <p>Honestly, I'm also kind of confused by the whole definition of "modesty" - I guess there is probably no single definition and it's what you personally define it as. But take something like Shabby Apple, for example, which is a site that sells "modest" dresses. Yes, they certainly don't sell anything that reveals a lot of skin but a lot of their dresses are still quite fitted and body-conscious. Similarly, the Mad Men style dresses that are popular now are quite covered up but still quite bombshell. I would be interested in hearing what people who actually do consciously try to dress modestly think of styles like these? Does modest just mean covered up, or does it mean hiding one's shape and figure as well? Does it mean one should not be ostentatious with one's clothing? If you are covered up from head to toe but wearing giant diamonds, is that modest? </p>