https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence Style Advice for Fashion Lovers en-US Thu, 16 Apr 2026 18:32:07 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/search.php https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22668 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 14:34:22 +0000 Sarah 22668@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I too was the 'fat' sister and had a 'skinny' sister and that was hard. Everyone, including myself, was constantly comparing us. She's on the far left of the photo I posted (the other is my older sister). Now she is my best friend and greatest support and motivator. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22666 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 14:23:48 +0000 Angie 22666@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Sad, sad stories. Yours ended happily, Shiny. I hope that J’s does too. </p> <p>(you are remembering correctly Maya. My degree is in Psychology, but when I finished that I started again and did fashion design). </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22647 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 12:16:35 +0000 Nicole 22647@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I have seven sisters...one of them suffered with a severe eating disorder from the time she was 12 until well into her 30's. (She still has issues, but her weight is under control now, and she's in her mid 40's). I have another sister who had a short lived bout with bulemia, and I have 2 obese sisters, and a few, like me, who struggle to keep their weight under control. (One of my obese sister's is having gastric bypass surgery next month--which I have mixed emotions about). Three of my sisters have diabetes--due to weight issues. One has managed to control her diabetes with diet and weight loss. </p> <p>I could go into great detail about why I think my family has these kinds of problems--but I don't think the solution is in discussing what is behind us. What's done is done. But I will say, that my sister who almost died from anorexia and bulemia had control issues. Her eating was her way of controlling her life. It was the one thing that no one else had control over.</p> <p>I beleive that there is little psychological difference between people whose lifestyle leads to obesity, and people with anorexia and bulemia.</p> <p>I can also tell you that the life my sister lived (the one with the severe eating disorder), was hell. It was hell on her, hell on my mother and father, hell on my other sisters and me. I am sure your friend, is in her own private hell and does not want to live the rest of her life like this. She is probably afraid to change and does not how to do it. That is why I think it's a good idea to gingerly broach the subject with her--plant the seed, and let her know you are there to help, whenever she is ready. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22642 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 06:36:17 +0000 Maya 22642@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>According to her, she has always been like this. There hasn't been a single moment in her life where she wasn't overweight, other than maybe when she was born. So I'm sure that contributes to her accepting it. </p> <p>I often feel guilty around her because I feel like I have everything she didn't/doesn't have. I have a pretty normal family, grew up relatively well off, never had to worry about money (well, until recently), don't really struggle with boyfriends or relationships, and the only weight issue I ever had was being underweight. So I almost feel like I exacerbate some of her sore spots just by existing and talking about my life. Maybe that's why I want to help her so badly. I want her to enjoy some of the things I do! I don't have much control over her family life and financial situation, but I think I might be able to help her with the other stuff. </p> <p>She, her mom, and her sis have a good relationship overall but like most families there are some rough patches. I guess I don't want to psychoanalyze her. She seems fine most of the time, and if anything is wrong, I'll just make sure she knows she can tell me. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22637 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 05:09:31 +0000 shiny 22637@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>ohhh... Tiny sister and fat sister.... there's your complex emotional issue. </p> <p>I have two daughters. I have a sister. </p> <p>The thing with sisters is that we take on labels. Growing up, my sister was the "Curvy attractive wild-child outgoing" one; so I ended up taking on the opposite label "shapeless unattractive don't-rock-the-boat wallflower." </p> <p>It took me years but I'm definetly no wallflower anymore and I'm getting over the shapeless unattractive one! Except when I'm around my sis (which is unfortunately infrequently because she lives miles and miles away) I find myself reverting and clamming up again. </p> <p>I always thought it was my parent's fault, that they forced these opposite labels on us, until I had my own daughters!!! I have steered as far away from labels as possible... and yet... my girls take them on for themselves anyway!!! They gravitate towards opposites, to carve out identity in the family dynamic. Big example: one is a super picky eater, the other is adventuresome and will eat frog legs and escargot and sushi. One is Abercrombie&#38;Fitch, the other is euro-goth-punk. Etc. </p> <p>I'm constantly telling them that they do not need to take opposites; they are unique individuals and it is perfectly okay if they *both* like the same things or are similar. Just as it's okay if they are different. </p> <p>So maybe that is the key? Maybe your friend took on the "fat" role because her sister already occupied the "skinny" role? </p> <p>You might be able to gently probe about that.... not fat/skinny... just ask her - in general - about this whole concept of sisters taking on opposite labels. See where that conversation goes. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22636 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 05:04:06 +0000 Maya 22636@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Angie, am I remembering correctly that your original major was psychology, or am I just making that up based on your post? I know it's very complicated which is why I'm not certain how I should deal with it, but you ladies have given me insight. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22561 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 01:29:05 +0000 julijuli 22561@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I second the motion - you are a wonderful friend to be concerned about her and when she is ready to make changes it will be so helpful to have you there! I believe that the best thing you can do is let her know that you are there and ready to help. It also might be really hard for her to deal with the fact that her younger sister IS tiny. As Angie said, obesity is often rooted in deep issues and that may be one of them. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22544 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 01:00:50 +0000 Tanya 22544@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Everything has already been said and the ladies have provided such great advice.<br /> All I wanted to say is that she is really lucky to have such a great friend as you, Maya. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22534 Fri, 29 Aug 2008 00:50:31 +0000 Julia 22534@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I don't have much more to add but just wanted to chime in to say that you are a wonderful friend Maya! I agree with Shiny, Nicole and Angie 100%. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22505 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 23:18:34 +0000 Angie 22505@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Maya, thank you for being a fabulous friend to J. I applaud your love and concern for her. </p> <p>Sarah, Joy and Mirah – your stories touched my heart. I applaud you too. Such courage and inspiration you bring to this forum. I am in complete awe. Thank you for sharing your experiences. Such style on the inside AND out. </p> <p>Shiny and Nicole, you’re wise cookies. I’m also calling a spade a spade: you can take a horse to water but you can’t make it drink. I would guess that J’s challenge is psychological. Her obesity is merely a manifestation of deeply complex issues that need to be resolved and are instead being repressed. The outcome is denial. Obesity is also often rooted in depression and then it's a vicious circle. </p> <p>The question is Maya, how are you going to help J with her denial? Therapy is an option. So are support groups and forums. </p> <p>I’d withhold any reference to diet and exercise too. This might very well cause a health issue. I’m sure everyone's comments have left you pondering. Good luck and keep us posted on how you’re feeling about J’s situation. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22467 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 21:49:47 +0000 Maya 22467@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I knew you guys would be helpful. This is why I love you. Sarah, Shiny, Mirah, and Joy...you are all fantastic inspiration and your words helped a lot. You all look just beautiful from what I have seen! But more importantly I'm glad you all FEEL better. That's what I want for her more than anything else. </p> <p>Shiny, I have considered that it's an emotional thing. I can't imagine she would have been abused or something and not have told me about it, considering how close we are, but I guess it's a sticky issue and very possible that she wouldn't tell me. I hope that's not it though :(</p> <p>Strangely, her younger sister is TINY. Maybe a little bigger than I am. I am baffled at how different the two of them turned out and I always wonder what the reasons would be, but who knows. My brother is 5'11...while my mom is 5'0, my dad is 5'8, and I am 5'2, so genetics certainly can play a role.</p> <p>Well the good news is that she moved to Boston (she was the friend I was visiting, actually) and now she's doing a lot of walking. I think that should help a lot and it certainly seemed to be a vast improvement from what I saw. She is also vegetarian like me, but her problem mainly lies in quantity rather than quality. So she definitely has some things going for her. </p> <p>I guess I'll make her aware of my concern, but I don't know how that will play out. She really seems to insist that she is fine and healthy. Shiny, I know it seems like it's obvious, but she doesn't think she personally has anything to worry about. She doesn't think her portion sizes are out of control, and as I said, when I even mention the word exercise, she just scoffs at the idea. My opinion is that the best kind of exercise is the kind you get without effort...like commuting, like walking dogs, gardening, cleaning the house, and just living daily life. But the fact remains that most people have desk jobs and spend most of the day sitting, so a supplement is almost always necessary. I don't want her to do any kind of crazy intense cardio weight lifting workout. Hatha yoga would probably be great for her. In any case, I can't really get inside her head and figure out what she truly believes. All I know is that on the surface, she behaves like it's a nonissue. To me, it just sounds like she is denying it, but knows in her heart that this is not good for her. But I guess you're all right, and that she has to be ready for the change. I just wonder what her wake up call will be, and I hope it's nothing scary. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22450 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 21:11:47 +0000 Nicole 22450@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Maya, you are a good friend.</p> <p>I agree with Shiny 100%. You can't make her change her attitude or her habits. She has to be ready willing and able to make those changes. But what you can do, is tell her that:</p> <p>a.) You love her<br /> b.) You are worried about her<br /> c.) You want to help her<br /> d.) You will not enable her</p> <p>Then leave it alone. In situations like this, I think the less you say the better. Because anything more will come off as preachy. You have every right to say those things to her, and none of those things should affect your relationship. It's important to keep the relatioship in tact because she will need your help when she's ready to make some changes. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22442 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 20:24:14 +0000 Anonymous 22442@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Maya, I commend you for being concerned about your friend. I've lost a lot of weight recently, although I wasn't always heavy. Mine came on gradually after age 40 and just seemed part of getting older, but when I was 30 I only weighed about 100 pounds, sometimes less. More aches and tiredness seemed to be due to age, I thought. At my largest I weighed 157 and wore a size 12 in most things. That's not huge, but it was for my body. To go from under 100 to over 150 is a huge increase in percentage of weight recently gained. We've had a strict low fat diet for over 10 years because my husband, who went from 29 to 36 inch waist apple shape had a cardiac arrest at a fairly young age. (Learned the danger of the apple shape!)</p> <p>My wake up call was a surprise diagnosis of type 2 diabetes. I now have to exercise at least 30 minutes a day and eat low carb. The dietician also cut my meals, especially meat, to 2- 3ounce portions a day, but I eat every 2-3 hours (15 carbs). I've been amazed at the results. As Sarah says, it has to be a change in your mind set to be healthy and you have to make the decision yourself. Any weight loss is just an added bonus. I was told not to pay any attention to chloresterol, calories or anything but carbs (and fiber which affects carbs) and the rest will take care of itself. That has happened. As the weight came off, the aches and pains disappeared. I have much more energy and feel 20 years younger. </p> <p>So you might begin any discussion with your friend on concern for her health. Has she had a recent checkup with fasting blood work?<br /> Any movement helps. Exercise can be dancing or swimming or dog walking. Small changes in life style and eating can add up. My story may not help you with your friend, but to know it's easy to make excuses at any age. Maybe it will help someone else who is putting on the pounds. I wish I'd caught the diabetes sooner. It's an auto-immune disease that will eventually lead to big problems, but I can keep them from developing as soon with the changes I've made. Maybe your friend and head off disease before damage is done. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22438 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 19:43:19 +0000 shiny 22438@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Maya, I have similar friends and family in my life. The best advice I can give you is this:</p> <p>1) Your friend knows she's overweight, and she undoubtedly knows it is a health issue. How could she not? It's all over the news, the obesity epidemic, etc. Her doctor probably tells her all the time she needs to lose weight. </p> <p>2) Some people with obesity get that way for emotional reasons. For example, I became overweight in my 20s because I was so angry at my then-husband at the time, I would eat all night long when he was home - to keep myself from expressing the anger. I would choose crunchy things and chomp away. </p> <p>Some people choose sweet things because it reminds them of childhood and calms and soothes. </p> <p>The fact she doesn't date... well... it could be that she is using the weight as a shield to deliberately keep men away from her. This may or may not be the case but, often kids who are sexually abused end up obese. The fat is protection to keep men away. Please note - this is not saying all people who are obese have been sexually abused. I just know a few people like that. </p> <p>Key point is: often weight has less to do with lifestyle choices, and a lot to do with deep-rooted emotional issues. The emotional issues need to be confronted and addressed. Once that happens, the lifestyle part is the easy part. </p> <p>If she whines and moans about wanting a boyfriend, but nobody will have her because of her weight THEN by all means... step in and tell her you're tired of hearing about it. If she is unhappy, she should change, you'll be her support, etc. </p> <p>But if she's not whining and moaning about it, then it's not an issue. Or one she is simply not ready to confront. Timing is everything. </p> <p>3) Tread carefully about any diet or exercise suggestions you make - even if she asks for your advice. Why... because I have learned the hard way that what works for someone who's merely overweight, does not work for someone who is obese. </p> <p>For example, I have an obese friend who really wanted to lose weight and turned to me for diet and exercise coaching, because she knew I knew my stuff (this has been an area of research for me for a long time - maybe it'll be a second career!). Well, I was so psyched to help her!! I designed a diet &#38; exercise plan - and quickly learned that it was all wrong for her. </p> <p>She couldn't take a 30 minute powerwalk each day. Because she was so heavy, the stress was too much on her knees. </p> <p>Calorie needs are much different too. And then there are health issues. Etc. The more overweight you are, the more complicated it is. </p> <p>I was way in over my head, and quite humbled by that experience!!</p> <p>4) People change when they are ready to change. For example, I was a long-time smoker. Everyone harped on me about it. I have relatives dying of lung cancer, my mom dx with emphysma, and still I persisted smoking. My kids got all teary and upset when kids at school told them they smelled like smoke. Still I persisted smoking. Yes, I knew all the health risks!! </p> <p>It didn't matter what anyone said - I wasn't ready to change until *I* was ready. My DH was the best at this - he never said a word. Never harped. Nothing. He loved me whether I smoked or not. Once or twice, he would say something like, "I would not be happy if you died too early on me." But he chose his moments carefully, and left it at that. </p> <p>When one *is* ready to change, change happens pretty rapidly and dramatically. It's just the process of wanting to change that takes the longest time. </p> <p>Just be there when she's ready to change, then she should be under a doc's supervision, and your job is to root her on and support her. It's her job to do the changing. When and if she decides to. </p> <p>Not much else you can do! </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22430 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 18:56:44 +0000 mirah 22430@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Hi Maya..first let me say that you are a really good and kind friend! </p> <p>I have struggled with weight issues since I entered my 20s after being healthy all along. Since wrong medication and hereditary conditions was my issue, I had something to blame which worked against me. I entered into exactly this phase of "complacence" that you mention. Instead of working against the problem, I spent a good two years wallowing in self-pity, that I would never be pretty or no one is ever going to want me. I did have my parents trying to coax me into exercise routines and diets and trust me..I did those too. Nothing really helped till the time I decided that I had a choice between being a fighter or a whiner. I am still a size 16.. and i may probably never be a size 8 that i was before ( i still have my skinny jeans to fit into when i achieve that goal..even if it happens when i am 50) but I can say I am a healthier person, emotionally and physically. And being healthy really changes life.</p> <p>You are right in thinking that your friend is probably just outwardly trying to show that she is okay with who she is. Maybe she does want to change but has lost the confidence. However she does need to see and really get, that weight problems lead to really serious health problems which will threaten her normal day-to-day life. It would be great if you can talk to her and express your concern about her health without bringing up topics like size or relationships. Its rather tricky because she needs to know that you care for her (which she obviously does) Its easy to get defensive and feel that people are judging us or they dont understand when all you are trying to is help. But I can vouch that having a supportive group of friends and family works wonders to boost confidence. </p> <p>And Sarah..you are an inspiration! </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22426 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 18:45:02 +0000 Anonymous 22426@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>You're not offensive at all. It is a sensitive situation. I have a similar friend and I say nothing but I feel deeply for her. I guess I stay in denial. I'm very quiet. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22424 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 18:28:26 +0000 Sarah 22424@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>Another thought (this touches so closely to my heart!): Change is hard. I have always been overweight and could not imagine myself thin. I also couldn't handle failing so it was easier to stay overweight and introverted rather than confront my fears.<br /> Here I am at 200 pounds, size 16. Everyone I meet now can hardly believe that was me!<br /> <a href="http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_JA8_7TSUcfs/SJsnFuUdL-I/AAAAAAAABKI/D86-XeuHiTI/s1600-h/blog.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_JA8_.....h/blog.jpg</a> </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22423 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 18:25:01 +0000 Sarah 22423@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>First of all, how wonderful of you to care about your friend like this.<br /> I can certainly understand where she's at - I was there up until a year ago. I was sick, exhausted, and had very low self-esteem because of choices *I* was making. It wasn't until two stays in the hospital (and a nurse showing me my recently removed pickled gall bladder) that I got scared enough to change.<br /> I will tell you though, it wasn't until I made up my mind to change that it happened. I had family especially willing to support and encourage me every step of the way, but until I made the first step, they couldn't do anything but watch.<br /> I think it's important to stress health over size or weight in pounds. And it's also important for your friend to realize that being skinny doesn't equal happiness. She must come to terms with who she is now, because that will not change when the size does. Often times weight is just a mask to a deeper unfulfilled need.<br /> My advice would be to continue being her friend, and hope that eventually she will feel comfortable enough to confide in you. Be healthy yourself - live a balanced, whole life in front of her. Accept her for who she is now (I can really tell you're doing this, and I'm sure it means a lot to her).<br /> If you feel comfortable, sit down and have a heart to heart. Share with her what you just told us.<br /> And lastly, purchase her The Best Life Diet by Bob Greene and read it with her if she's willing. The word "diet" is so misleading in that title as he does not believe in dieting, but in changing lifestyles. The first chapter of the book deals with the question Why are you overweight? Until someone can fix that, they will continue trying and failing over and over.<br /> I have written my story out several times, so if J gets to the place where she's ready, I'd be happy to get that for you. I too am in my 20's and am just now able to live life to the fullest. It doesn't mean someone overweight can't be happy, I just truly believe that a healthy person is happiest. </p> https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/topic/acceptance-vs-complacence#post-22420 Thu, 28 Aug 2008 18:08:10 +0000 Maya 22420@https://youlookfab.com/welookfab/ <p>I have wondered about this for a long time but am afraid to post about it because it might hit a nerve for some folks, but it's really bothering me and I know YLF is generally a supportive place.</p> <p>The question is about my friend (I'll just call her J). She is a very good friend and I care about her a lot, and she is even more of a girly girl than I am. Loves to wear makeup, loves clothes and shopping, and jewelry and shoes and bags. She is around 5'5, a size 22 and VERY apple-shaped. In fact, she carries her weight almost exclusively around the midsection but her legs are relatively slim. </p> <p>Problem is, even though she says she feels fine the way she is, I know she's lying. I know because she is 25 years old and hasn't ever had a boyfriend because she says "no one ever wants her." She blames this on most men being too shallow to accept her size, but I don't think it's true. I think she just lacks the confidence to put in any effort. I have seen her avoid pursuing relationships with people she is interested in because, as she believes, they would never go for her and she would just be embarrassed. Then when they end up with someone else, she is just heartbroken, but insists she did the right thing. She has a kind of false confidence about her, if that makes sense--says she loves and accepts herself and her size, but when push comes to shove, her confidence is shaken.</p> <p>I also know that contrary to what she believes, this is probably NOT "just how she is." I know she can change and that she should change. If you think I'm just being a "skinny b****" I assure you that's not it. I know it is very likely that she is the shape and size she is because of how she eats, and her lack of exercise. It worries me. Her size itself doesn't worry me. I would probably worry if she was a size 6 if her lifestyle habits were the same, but that seems very unlikely. She scoffs whenever I mention exercise (in general, not pertaining to her), and seems to be in denial about her eating habits. I know this is a very complicated issue, and many of you will say I shouldn't say anything and just be supportive. But if anything happened to her I would feel awful, and terribly guilty for sitting silently and watching it happen even though I knew something was off. Now seems like the best time to start taking control of her body and her confidence, while she's still young. It's only going to get harder as she grows older. </p> <p>I also know that this isn't comfortable for her. She gets heat rashes where her arms rub against her torso, and although most people have some chafing discomfort between the thighs, hers is extreme. She seems exhausted just by climbing a few stairs. But she has accepted all of this as just a part of life. </p> <p>I don't honestly care if she is a size 4 or 24. I care about her health, and it does seem to me that her size is the result of her health. If she puts some legitimate effort into a better lifestyle, and still ends up being a size 22 apple, then fine. I'll be more at ease. I can only imagine how hard it would be, and how long the process would take, but it would be worth it, I think. I read a study recently that showed that overweight and even obese people can be healthy, and the key is weight distribution. If she were a size 22 pear or hourglass, she might actually not have so much to worry about, but to carry all her weight around her vital organs doesn't sound so good.</p> <p>So anyway, I wonder where do we draw the line between accepting our size and shape and being complacent about it. I don't want her to feel BAD about who she is. I don't want her to feel ashamed, ugly, or less than human. She could be any size or shape and she would still be an amazing and beautiful person and great friend. But in embracing her size, it seems like she has just accepted that she can't do any better. </p> <p>I know some of you here have lost a lot of weight, or are in the process of losing weight, and I would be interested to hear what you think of all of this. Also, please understand I am not making judgments about anyone else's lifestyle, weight, or shape. I am speaking only of one specific person because I am very familiar with her, but I don't go passing judgment on people who I know nothing about. I hope I haven't said anything offensive. </p>